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  1. #17
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Quote Originally Posted by jmclaughtx
    Lincoln suspended Habeus Corpus twice during the Civil War, Jackson suspended Habeus Corpus twice for a six mile area around New Orleans, FDR tapped every mail and telegraph from Pearl Harbor throughout WWII, EVERYTHING from Europe went through the island of Bermuda and was listened to or opened and read.

    I am not misinformed and your comments about Bush annointing himself as King make for good soundbites but can not be factually backed up.

    As far as your comments on being at war are concerned, go visit the middle east and when we see you on video getting your head lopped off simply because you are an american, then try and convince me we are not at war.

    I watched the towers fall that morning in September and I have no doubt we are at war. I do not need Bush or the democrats to tell me that.
    LOL...You are simply regurgitating my statements about Lincoln and Roosevelt, not making any points, whatsoever. I've been to the Middle East a number of times including Israel and The Illegally Occupied Territories of The West Bank.

    Furthermore, my apartment is 3 blocks away from Ground Zero facing the site from the 37th floor so I was a bit more impressed and affected by it than someone who simply watched it all happen on television. In fact, my business partner who lives nearby won a Pulitzer Prize for his reporting on it.

    So, you see, I don't need someone like yourself trying to impress upon me the effects and ramifications of that incident. Your pretensions notwithstanding, you will never know how it really affected the immediate victims. And your pre-packaged impressions of reality such as "The War On Terrorism"(tm) really are adulterated sound bites and images that have been force fed to you through a manipulative media and its political programming. And, sadly, you’re obviously not sentient enough to recognize your own submissive mental process in the mix.

    You are quite sadly mistaken in your assumption that the office of Presidency confers upon the holder the arbitrary right to break Federal Law and/or the presumption of being able to arrogate upon himself the right to make up his own laws as he goes along to suit his agenda. That is the power of a King, not a duly elected public official.

    And you're obviously quite misinformed about the portent of the FISA Act. There is no relevancy or corollary between Bush's spying and the conduct of Lincoln and Roosevelt. FISA wasn't enacted until 1978 and the effect of the statute renders Bush's spying activities on Americans unconditionally illegal.

    Clearly and typically of most right-wing nuts, you are as misinformed about the Constitution and The Law as you are misguided in your naive' pretensions about 911, its victims and the overall ramifications.

    BTW: You should learn how to spell Habeas Corpus first before attemping to debate people about it.
    Last edited by dante; 02-09-2006 at 11:42 PM.

  2. #18
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Quote Originally Posted by dante
    LOL...You are simply regurgitating my statements about Lincoln and Roosevelt, not making any points, whatsoever. I've been to the Middle East a number of times including Israel and The Illegally Occupied Territories of The West Bank.

    Furthermore, my apartment is 3 blocks away from Ground Zero facing the site from the 37th floor so I was a bit more impressed and affected by it than someone who simply watched it all happen on television. In fact, my business partner who lives nearby won a Pulitzer Prize for his reporting on it.

    So, you see, I don't need someone like yourself trying to impress upon me the effects and ramifications of that incident. Your pretensions notwithstanding, you will never know how it really affected the immediate victims. And your pre-packaged impressions of reality such as "The War On Terrorism"(tm) really are adulterated sound bites and images that have been force fed to you through a manipulative media and its political programming. And, sadly, you’re obviously not sentient enough to recognize your own submissive mental process in the mix.

    You are quite sadly mistaken in your assumption that the office of Presidency confers upon the holder the arbitrary right to break Federal Law and/or the presumption of being able to arrogate upon himself the right to make up his own laws as he goes along to suit his agenda. That is the power of a King, not a duly elected public official.

    And you're obviously quite misinformed about the portent of the FISA Act. There is no relevancy or corollary between Bush's spying and the conduct of Lincoln and Roosevelt. FISA wasn't enacted until 1978 and the effect of the statute renders Bush's spying activities on Americans unconditionally illegal.

    Clearly and typically of most right-wing nuts, you are as misinformed about the Constitution and The Law as you are misguided in your naive' pretensions about 911, its victims and the overall ramifications.

    BTW: You should learn how to spell Habeas Corpus first before attemping to debate people about it.

    A simple miss spell does not take away my valid argument. I did not regurgitate anything, I stated proven and documented facts. As far as calling me a right wing nut, I smile at the fact that you feel the need to insult me in your effort to discredit my facts. That tactic may work with others but it does not work here.

    Bush did not break Federal law, your whole argument is based on that, and on that point I believe you to be clearly wrong.
    Last edited by jmclaughtx; 02-10-2006 at 12:21 AM. Reason: wording

  3. #19
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    dchristie occasionally resorts to pointing out spelling errors in lieu of debate.

    What IS clear is that many Americans do not APPRECIATE their freedom and privacy and take for granted the efforts required to ensure its continuation.

  4. #20
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Let's see what happens here. If Bush is breaking the law instead of facing the music he can have all the elected officials that oppose him hauled off to jail. AG Gonzales WOULD BE HAPPY TO HELP HIM OUT.

    Bush faces Congress revolt over spying

    http://news.moneycentral.msn.com/pro...209&ID=5489703


    Gonzales: NSA may tap 'ordinary' Americans' e-mail
    06 Feb 2006
    Agents operating a controversial National Security Agency surveillance program may have inadvertently spied on the e-mails and phone calls of Americans with no ties to terrorists, Attorney General Alberto Gonzales said Monday.

    Q.: FEINSTEIN: Can the President suspend the application of the Posse Comitatus Act?
    GONZALES: Of course, Senator that is not what is at issue here. This is not about law enforcement; this is about foreign intelligence –
    FEINSTEIN: I understand. I'm asking the questions. You choose not to answer it?
    GONZALES: Yes, ma'am.
    Last edited by Phinnly Slash Buster; 02-10-2006 at 01:35 AM.

  5. #21
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Quote Originally Posted by jmclaughtx
    A simple miss spell does not take away my valid argument. I did not regurgitate anything, I stated proven and documented facts. As far as calling me a right wing nut, I smile at the fact that you feel the need to insult me in your effort to discredit my facts. That tactic may work with others but it does not work here.
    LOL... What argument? You didn't pose an argument. That's because you have none. Is claiming that Roosevelt intercepted mail meant to be an argument for something? What might that be? I'm perplexed.

    Roosevelt also often claimed that The US Navy had spotted German u-boats near Coney Island inorder to foment anti-"Hun" hysteria. So what? I'm not trying to insult you. I'm sorry you find the truth insulting.

    Quote Originally Posted by jimclaughtx
    Bush did not break Federal law, your whole argument is based on that, and on that point I believe you to be clearly wrong.
    Bush faces Republican revolt over spying
    By Edward Alden and Holly Yeager in Washington
    Financial Times Published: February 9, 2006

    Congressional Republicans are threatening to force a legal showdown with President George W. Bush over his claim that he has the constitutional power to order domestic surveillance of Americans in the name of national security.

    On its face, the programme appears to violate the 1978 Foreign Intelligence Surveillance Act (Fisa), in which Congress required that domestic eavesdropping for intelligence purposes could only be done with warrants from a special court set up under Fisa. Alberto Gonzales, the attorney-general, failed to persuade Democrats and many Republicans in all-day Senate testimony on Monday that the president has inherent wartime powers that allowed him to bypass that requirement.
    Last edited by dante; 02-10-2006 at 02:48 AM.

  6. #22
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Quote Originally Posted by pwrone

    What IS clear is that many Americans do not APPRECIATE their freedom and privacy and take for granted the efforts required to ensure its continuation.
    Spoken like a true Soviet Style G.O.P Commie Rat who thinks that our freedoms are something granted by the state. Freedom is something that you are either using or losing.

  7. #23
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Dante wrote
    I'm sorry you find the truth insulting.
    Depends on whether it is truth or just more anger and fabrication from the left.

    I have seen a lot of that here. If you were to review the titles of most of the threads here and understand from an objective point of view that if even 1 out of every 50 charges were true, Bush would already have been impeached, but as it is, he is not and will not be. That is just a simple fact.

  8. #24
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Quote Originally Posted by jmclaughtx
    Dante wrote

    Depends on whether it is truth or just more anger and fabrication from the left.

    I have seen a lot of that here. If you were to review the titles of most of the threads here and understand from an objective point of view that if even 1 out of every 50 charges were true, Bush would already have been impeached, but as it is, he is not and will not be. That is just a simple fact.

    Ha..ha..ha.. That's like saying if Stalin were such a bad guy, the Soviet Politbureau would have deposed him. You really should take some very basic civics courses in congressional procedure.

  9. #25
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Quote Originally Posted by dante
    Ha..ha..ha.. That's like saying if Stalin were such a bad guy, the Soviet Politbureau would have deposed him. You really should take some very basic civics courses in congressional procedure.
    The bottom line is what counts, most of the charges that are presented here at this forum are pretty much conjecture and conspiracy from far left leaning websites and bloggers. If you took the stories from the far right and the far left and mixed them well, you might have a few elements of truth. And that, well, that is the rest of the story, as Paul Harvey used to say.

    As far as the civics courses, I will see you in class.

  10. #26
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Quote Originally Posted by jmclaughtx
    The bottom line is what counts, most of the charges that are presented here at this forum are pretty much conjecture and conspiracy from far left leaning websites and bloggers. If you took the stories from the far right and the far left and mixed them well, you might have a few elements of truth. And that, well, that is the rest of the story, as Paul Harvey used to say.

    As far as the civics courses, I will see you in class.

    If Bush isn't feeding his slavish cabal of right-wing, glassy-eyed loonies a steady diet of enough lies and propaganda for the day from his G.O.P Commie Media Pulpit, there's always a ready array of rabid right-wing fanatical, slobbering vermin like Limbaugh, Hannity, Coulter, Boortz, Grant, Liddy, North et al..on auto pilot to make sure the environment is properly saturated with enough electromagnetic, fascist sewage to hold them over for a fresh serving. I can't even turn on my car radio anymore without getting nauseous.

    Bush's crimes aren't the stuff of conjecture, except in your hallucinations. The outrageous criminality and incompetence of his mob are well documented, regardless of the corporate media's attempts to minimize and whitewash it.

    Tell the families of all of Bush's dead, maimed, tortured and displaced victims in Iraq and New Orleans that those body bags are just conjecture on their part.

  11. #27
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Quote Originally Posted by dante
    If Bush isn't feeding his slavish cabal of right-wing, glassy-eyed loonies a steady diet of enough lies and propaganda for the day from his G.O.P Commie Media Pulpit, there's always a ready array of rabid right-wing fanatical, slobbering vermin like Limbaugh, Hannity, Coulter, Boortz, Grant, Liddy, North et al..on auto pilot to make sure the environment is properly saturated with enough electromagnetic, fascist sewage to hold them over for a fresh serving. I can't even turn on my car radio anymore without getting nauseous.

    Bush's crimes aren't the stuff of conjecture, except in your hallucinations. The outrageous criminality and incompetence of his mob are well documented, regardless of the corporate media's attempts to minimize and whitewash it.

    Tell the families of all of Bush's dead, maimed, tortured and displaced victims in Iraq and New Orleans that those body bags are just conjecture on their part.

    Well, Dante, I wish you the best, I personally could not go through life with that much anger inside. History will prove your hysteria to be exactly what it truly is. Baseless.

    Good luck.

  12. #28
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    Re: AMERICANS HATE THEIR FREEDOM & PRIVACY

    Quote Originally Posted by jmclaughtx
    Well, Dante, I wish you the best, I personally could not go through life with that much anger inside. History will prove your hysteria to be exactly what it truly is. Baseless.

    Good luck.
    I'll drink to that. But history will prove me correct as it has already begun to partially unfold and reveal itself before the eyes of those discerning enough to interpret its implications.

    Let's hope we learn to start respecting each other's common humanity more than those things which define us by national boundaries ..before it's too late. War is the failure of the human spirit. It should never be promoted and pursued as a response or solution, except as an ultimate act of self defense.
    That's the most important lesson of history.

    Here's a link for you offered in good faith. Take from it what you will. Click Here
    Last edited by dante; 02-10-2006 at 08:40 PM.

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