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  1. #17
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    Sep 2005
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    586

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    Quote Originally Posted by Rusted
    No Fly List is a stupid concept. If one person named John Doe did something bad, then all people named John Doe are considered bad.

    As for "Homeland", bad semantics. Reminds me of the Vaterland, the Rodina, and the Motherland. People only hear those terms when the Gov in charge decides to take away rights from the people.

    The old South Africa came up with the concept of Homelands. They were and still are, scrubby worthless patches of land where inconveniant local populations who happened to be there first were sent to get them out of the way of the populations that came later. They got their own back, guess who opened the first casinos there?

    Since when is the only remaining Global Superpower a homeland? Never.

    I had to fill out the new I-9 this year. Since when should I prove that I am not an illegal? Then's there's the other "I am not a bum" form.
    Hi Rusted,

    What is the "new" I-9 form? Are American citizens supposed to fill this form out now? Did it just start this Year(2006)?

    By the way, I agree with everything in your post. :)

    DeeDee1965

  2. #18
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    Nov 2005
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    645

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    It's the same "I am not a illegal" form we fill out for employment but when the form was changed to DHS, my employer explained that we all had to do it, and get this, do it every year.

  3. #19
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
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    12,866

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    Quote Originally Posted by Rusted
    It's the same "I am not a illegal" form we fill out for employment but when the form was changed to DHS, my employer explained that we all had to do it, and get this, do it every year.

    Absolutely, my husband has to do the same damn thing. He was born and raised here, his SSC he got when he was a child. It's a simple matter of just flagging the SSC numbers as safe.

    For a country with a law to reduce paperwork, http://www.cio.noaa.gov/itmanagement/pralaw.pdf
    it sure creates a hell of a lot of extra paperwork every year.

    Namaste'

    Lady Mod

  4. #20
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    Feb 2005
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    12,866

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    Quote Originally Posted by DeeDee1965
    Lady Mod,

    All I can say is, OH MY GOD!! :eek:

    It is funny, if they were "listening " to your conversation, they might have heard "exactly" what you said, and realized the meaning of your words. Now that I think of it, if they are going to listen, they should learn to understand basic English. This is what happens when critical thinking is not taught in the schools. :p LOL

    Seriously, if that kind of thing happens to me (I am an African-American woman), it might become more of a "situation." I say "might," I cannot be sure of that, I just do not want to have the hassle. I was born here, I should not be afraid, paranoid, or uncomfortable about traveling in my own country. I just do not like the thought of it. I am law-abiding, I pay my taxes, and I mind my own business. Having to explain myself, while traveling within the US, would irritate the heck out of me.

    I know the world has changed, but for many citizens in this country, things have just been kicked up another notch. :rolleyes:

    DeeDee1965
    Oh I was being majorly sarcastic with them and probably walked real close to crossing the line but it was beyond coincidence. I can believe the first check, even the first hand check at boarding, but the other was pushing that envelope.

    There was so much abuse going on with the hand checks at the time. And it's such a stupid system, the terrorists did not blow up the planes, they walked boldly on and took them over in flight and crashed the planes. Technically anyone well trained in hand to hand combat could do the same thing without a weapon, not as easily but they could.

    And I've flown around the country several times since then without a hitch and without a separate search even carrying knitting needles on board. Now I could understand a ban on aluminum needles, straight needles are 6 - 18 inches in length, they can do some damage, even circulars could be used as a weapon, they are all allowed now, but heaven help you if you have a tiny pair of manicure scissors, those 1/2" to 1" blades are a major death threat. :rolleyes:

    The rules are ignorant and make no sense at all when it comes to national safety.

    I will admit though, it was fun to "walk that fine line".

    Namaste'

    Lady Mod
    Last edited by sojustask; 01-08-2006 at 12:31 AM.

  5. #21
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    Sep 2005
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    586

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    Quote Originally Posted by sojustask
    Oh I was being majorly sarcastic with them and probably walked real close to crossing the line but it was beyond coincidence. I can believe the first check, even the first hand check at boarding, but the other was pushing that envelope.

    There was so much abuse going on with the hand checks at the time. And it's such a stupid system, the terrorists did not blow up the planes, they walked boldly on and took them over in flight and crashed the planes. Technically anyone well trained in hand to hand combat could do the same thing without a weapon, not as easily but they could.

    And I've flown around the country several times since then without a hitch and without a separate search even carrying knitting needles on board. Now I could understand a ban on aluminum needles, straight needles are 6 - 18 inches in length, they can do some damage, even circulars could be used as a weapon, they are all allowed now, but heaven help you if you have a tiny pair of manicure scissors, those 1/2" to 1" blades are a major death threat. :rolleyes:

    The rules are ignorant and make no sense at all when it comes to national safety.

    I will admit though, it was fun to "walk that fine line".

    Namaste'

    Lady Mod
    Hi Lady Mod,

    It is interesting the point you make about someone trained in hand to hand combat. I know that the highly trained special forces people can kill or disable someone without to much fuss or muss. So having knitting needles, manicure scissors and the like are just not a factor, if someone has a mind to do, maximum damage and harm, with minor trouble.

    I am trying to look at the situation with more of a light heart. I am beginning to think Homeland Security is watching to many MacGyver episodes. "With only duct tape and a Swiss Army knife, you can do anything." LOL :p If they are getting their ideas from the entertainment world, they should look at the first Rambo film.

    And I bet it was thrilling to" walk that fine line." Just as long as the line is, three steps long. LOL :D

    Also thanks for the link. Whatever happened to the desire to "reduce government?" :rolleyes:

    DeeDee1965

  6. #22
    Join Date
    Jun 2005
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    1,222

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    I saw the 4 year old mentioned. What's his story?

    SEATTLE POST-INTELLIGENCER
    http://seattlepi.nwsource.com/nation...eschooler.html

    Thursday, January 5, 2006 ยท Last updated 11:18 a.m. PT

    4-year-old boy on government 'no-fly' list

    By KRISTIE RIEKEN
    ASSOCIATED PRESS WRITER

    HOUSTON -- Edward Allen's reaction to being on the government's "no-fly" list should have been the tip-off that he is no terrorist.

    "I don't want to be on the list. I want to fly and see my grandma," the 4-year-old boy said, according to his mother.

    Sijollie Allen and her son had trouble boarding planes last month because someone with the same name as Edward is on a government terrorist watch list.

    "Is this a joke?" Allen recalled telling Continental Airlines agents Dec. 21 at Houston's Bush Intercontinental Airport. "You can tell he's not a terrorist."

    She said it took several minutes of pleading and a phone call by the ticket agent to get on the plane to New York.

    Allen, a Jamaican immigrant, said workers at La Guardia Airport were even more hard-nosed before their Dec. 26 flight home. She said a ticket agent told her: "You're lucky that we're letting you through instead of putting you through the other process."

    The Transportation Security Administration's "no-fly" list was established immediately after the Sept. 11, 2001, attacks to prevent people who may have terrorist ties from boarding commercial flights.

    "I know the government is trying to protect because of the terrorist attacks, but common sense should play a role in it," Allen said. "I don't think he should go through the trouble of being harassed and hindered."

    TSA regional spokeswoman Carrie Harmon said the agency tells airlines not to deny boarding to children under 12 or select them for extra security checks even if their names match ones on the list.

    "We do not require ID for children because there are no children on the list," Harmon said. "If it's a child, ticket agents have the authority to immediately de-select them."

    Continental spokesman Dave Messing said Thursday that the airline would not discuss its security policies.

    Other people with common names who have encountered "no-fly" list problems at airports include Rep. John Lewis, D-Ga., and actor David Nelson from "The Adventures of Ozzie and Harriet." Sen. Edward M. Kennedy, D-Mass., has said he had to make several calls to federal officials before his name was separated from the one on the list.

  7. #23
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Posts
    622

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    Quote Originally Posted by bairdi
    I saw the 4 year old mentioned. What's his story?
    Didin't you hear? He threatened Bush with his pacifier.

  8. #24
    Join Date
    Jul 2005
    Posts
    6,553

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    Quote Originally Posted by Rusted
    It's the same "I am not a illegal" form we fill out for employment but when the form was changed to DHS, my employer explained that we all had to do it, and get this, do it every year.
    This is odd... I started with my present employer 6 years ago and have only filled out 1 I-9... when I hired in. Haven't seen one since.

    When did this begin? In '06?
    Haven't seen any HR memos on this either...

    cheers,
    Paul

  9. #25
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    12,866

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    Quote Originally Posted by PaulM
    This is odd... I started with my present employer 6 years ago and have only filled out 1 I-9... when I hired in. Haven't seen one since.

    When did this begin? In '06?
    Haven't seen any HR memos on this either...

    cheers,
    Paul
    Maybe some of the employers got it wrong? Perhaps this yearly thing isn't supposed to be a yearly thing.

    I've never seen the form, I just know my husband fills it out. He works in California right now.

    Namaste'

    Lady Mod

  10. #26
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    633

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    Quote Originally Posted by sojustask
    Maybe some of the employers got it wrong? Perhaps this yearly thing isn't supposed to be a yearly thing.

    I've never seen the form, I just know my husband fills it out. He works in California right now.

    Namaste'

    Lady Mod
    If he is a contractor or moves from one office to another even within the same company tey may have him fill a new one out because his payroll get processed from a different location.

    We have not been notified that new I-9s need to be filled out by our employees each year. We do update the W-4s from time to time however.

  11. #27
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    12,866

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    Quote Originally Posted by RegulationE
    If he is a contractor or moves from one office to another even within the same company tey may have him fill a new one out because his payroll get processed from a different location.

    We have not been notified that new I-9s need to be filled out by our employees each year. We do update the W-4s from time to time however.

    That could be the reason too. He's in one place now so maybe he won't have to fill one out this year. I'll have to have him tell me if he does or not, now that I'm more curious about it.

    Lady Mod

  12. #28
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    Jun 2005
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    1,222

    Re: Author of "Bush's Brain", Put on "No Fly" List

    And the list just keeps growing.

    January 8th, 2006 1:57 pm
    No-fly list ends beach vacation

    Unclear what awaits Ontario man detained in Mexico after name catches U.S.

    By Karen Howlett / Globe and Mail

    TORONTO -- It was supposed to be a week of sun and sand at a resort in Mexico for Sami Kahil and his family. Instead, Mr. Kahil's wife, Rima, and their two young sons were flown right back to their home in Mississauga after arriving in Acapulco Thursday afternoon -- while he ended up in a Mexican jail.

    The problem for Mr. Kahil is that his name happens to be on a "no-fly" list of people prohibited from entering the United States. That sparked an international incident involving officials in three countries and no end of shock and dismay for his wife and children.

    "He's done nothing wrong," an exasperated Ms. Kahil said in an interview yesterday. "He's not the person they're looking for."

    Mr. Kahil was due to arrive back in Canada this morning, escorted by RCMP officers on a private airplane that will avoid flying over U.S. air space. It is not at all clear what fate awaits him.

    Ms. Kahil said it's simply a case of mistaken identity -- Sami Kahil is a common name in the Middle East. Her 38-year-old husband is a native of Lebanon and a Canadian citizen who has lived here for 20 years. He owns and operates a shoe store in Scarborough.

    "We have nothing to do with politics or religion," she said.

    The U.S. no-fly list, designed to screen terrorists and protect continental borders, has thousands of names on it. It is not without problems. The likes of Senator Edward Kennedy, one of the most recognizable figures in U.S. politics, singer Cat Stevens and even Canada's Defence Minister, Bill Graham, have had trouble boarding commercial flights, or been blocked altogether, because their names were accidentally included on the list.

    All of this is little consolation to Ms. Kahil, who has spent virtually every minute since arriving home late Thursday enlisting the help of Canadian officials to get her husband out of jail and back home.

    She said the most upsetting thing for her was realizing that as Mexican immigration officials were telling her husband that he was not welcome in their country, no one notified officials in Canada.

    The family's plight began a few hours after they boarded an Air Transat charter flight at 8 a.m. Thursday, bound for Ixtapa. It was to be the first family vacation in more than five years, Ms. Kahil said.

    Fifteen minutes after the plane left Toronto's Pearson International Airport, the airline provided customs officials in the United States with a list of passengers. Agents ran the list through a national data base and up popped a name matching Mr. Kahil's.

    Air Transat spokeswoman Sophie Lussier said the charter airline runs 11,000 flights a year, but that this was the first time a passenger had ever been detained by immigration authorities because his name was on the no-fly list.

    When the plane landed in Acapulco, the Kahils were ushered into a room for questioning. Mug shots were taken of the couple, along with their sons, Karim and Adam, who are 8 and 6. But it was not until a couple of hours later that the Kahils found out why.

    Ms. Kahil and the children returned to Canada later that day and Mr. Kahil was put in a detention centre and his passport was confiscated.

    After Ms. Kahil made dozens of phone calls to the airline, her MP and Foreign Affairs, the wheels were put in motion yesterday afternoon for her husband to be returned to Canada.

    The biggest relief came for Ms. Kahil when she learned that her husband would be escorted by the RCMP rather than U.S. air marshals. She said she was terrified that the marshals would take him somewhere and that he would just disappear.

    "Even if he gets arrested, that's fine," she said. "We'll deal with it in Canada."

    Brian Doyle, a spokesman at the U.S. Department of Homeland Security in Washington, said his office will have no further involvement once Mr. Kahil arrives home.

    "He was of sufficient interest that we were concerned," he said. Names are not put on the list "willy-nilly," he added.

    Rodney Moore, a spokesman at the Department of Foreign Affairs in Ottawa, would not say yesterday what will happen to Mr. Kahil when he returns.

    As for Ms. Kahil and her family, it will be some time before they consider taking another vacation outside Canada.

    "My kids don't even want to hear the word Mexico or holiday," she said. "They don't even want to go on a plane."

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