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  1. #1
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    Lets talk numbers

    This is to all you out there who are crying about how many troops and that have been killed in Iraq.

    Yes you "Human Rights" activists that are running around calling Bush a "Mass Murderer".

    Yes YOU!

    Lets look at this shall we?

    According to this CNN Special Report http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2003/ira...es/casualties/

    There have been a total of 4,725 deaths as of December 26, 2005.

    Quote

    There have been 2,363 coalition deaths, 2,164 Americans, one Australian, 98 Britons, 13 Bulgarians, two Danes, two Dutch, two Estonians, one Hungarian, 26 Italians, one Kazakh, one Latvian, 17 Poles, one Salvadoran, three Slovaks, 11 Spaniards, two Thai and 18 Ukrainians in the war in Iraq as of December 26, 2005, according to a CNN count.

    Now according to THIS in the NEWS
    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051227/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq
    Another Mass Grave has been found in Iraq.

    [B]Quote[/B]

    BAGHDAD, Iraq - Municipal workers in the Shiite holy city of Karbala found remains believed to be from a mass grave dating to 1991, when Saddam Hussein's regime put down a Shiite uprising in the south.

    Also, more than 10,000 people marched through Baghdad in support of a national unity government of Sunnis and Shiites, while insurgent attacks killed six Iraqi policemen and two civilians in a fresh surge of violence.

    The remains were discovered Monday and were sent for testing Tuesday in an effort to identify the bodies, said Rahman Mashawy, a Karbala police spokesman. He did not say how many bodies were found, and the police claim could not be independently verified.

    Human rights organizations estimate that more than 300,000 people, mainly Kurds and Shiite Muslims, were killed and buried in mass graves during Saddam's 23-year rule, which ended when U.S.-led forces toppled his regime in 2003. Saddam and seven co-defendants are now on trial for the deaths of more than 140 Shiites after a 1982 attempt on Saddam's life in the town of Dujail, north of Baghdad.


    300,000 people in 23 years, means an avarage of 13,043 people a year killed by Saddam.
    4,725 people since the Iraq war has began is not even close to this number.

    Ohhh but all I see is how Bush was a murderer, but yet Saddam killed more people in 1 year than the entire time of war in Iraq, and no one says anything about it?

    What's wrong with this picture?

  2. #2
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    Re: Lets talk numbers

    HD we are responsible for the deaths under Saddam too. If the CIA hadn't helped put him in power, none of the deaths might have even happened.

    http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51/217.html

    http://www.muslimedia.com/archives/f...s98/saddam.htm

    http://www.globalpolicy.org/security...sseinindex.htm

    The blood of those innocent people killed is still all over American hands. So, what's to debate? It's past time to get out of the picture and allow that country to govern itself.

    Lady Mod

  3. #3
    Join Date
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    280

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by sojustask
    HD we are responsible for the deaths under Saddam too. If the CIA hadn't helped put him in power, none of the deaths might have even happened.

    http://www.hartford-hwp.com/archives/51/217.html

    http://www.muslimedia.com/archives/f...s98/saddam.htm

    http://www.globalpolicy.org/security...sseinindex.htm

    The blood of those innocent people killed is still all over American hands. So, what's to debate? It's past time to get out of the picture and allow that country to govern itself.

    Lady Mod
    The Debate is about how Bush is being called a mass murderer, when he has not even come close to those numbers.
    Yes maybe the U.S. put him in (Not G.W. Bush), but Bush TOOK HIM OUT!

  4. #4
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    Re: Lets talk numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by hdmarketing
    Yes maybe the U.S. put him in (Not G.W. Bush), but Bush TOOK HIM OUT!

    True, but Bush had to lie to get us over there to do it too. :D

    Bush the man is not responsible for mass murder, Bush the president is. If that's what you choose to call thousands of people getting killed in war, mass murders.

    Bush made poor choices and should get better advisers.

    JMO,

    Lady Mod

  5. #5
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    633

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by sojustask
    True, but Bush had to lie to get us over there to do it too. :D
    How many more times are people from the left going to use this already over played and disproven proven claim?

    Main Entry: lie
    Function: verb
    Inflected Form(s): lied; lying /'lI-i[ng]/
    Etymology: Middle English, from Old English lEogan; akin to Old High German liogan to lie, Old Church Slavonic lugati
    intransitive senses
    1 : to make an untrue statement with intent to deceive
    2 : to create a false or misleading impression
    transitive senses : to bring about by telling lies

    One can not lie about something they believe to be true based on the information they have.

    If you tell me you are 30 years old but you are really 25, then you have told a lie.

    When I tell someone you are 30 years old after you have infromed me of the same, I am not telling a lie because I am making my claim based on the infromation you provided.

    This "Bush Lied" has gotten so old, even the democrats in Congress have stopped saying it. About the time the independant investigation into the intel availalbe at the time came out, they stopped calling bush a lier.

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
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    12,866

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by RegulationE
    How many more times are people from the left going to use this already over played and disproven proven claim?

    Main Entry: lie
    Function: verb
    Inflected Form(s): lied; lying /'lI-i[ng]/
    Etymology: Middle English, from Old English lEogan; akin to Old High German liogan to lie, Old Church Slavonic lugati
    intransitive senses
    1 : to make an untrue statement with intent to deceive
    2 : to create a false or misleading impression
    transitive senses : to bring about by telling lies

    One can not lie about something they believe to be true based on the information they have.

    If you tell me you are 30 years old but you are really 25, then you have told a lie.

    When I tell someone you are 30 years old after you have infromed me of the same, I am not telling a lie because I am making my claim based on the infromation you provided.

    This "Bush Lied" has gotten so old, even the democrats in Congress have stopped saying it. About the time the independant investigation into the intel availalbe at the time came out, they stopped calling bush a lier.
    I've already posted articles (one here) that show that the president acted on information he was given too hastily. It wasn't verified as true and did NOT come from a reliable source, that the information came from a KNOWN liar who says he told the story to escape torture.

    So, I guess we will keep saying it because it's true.

    Lady Mod

  7. #7
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    622

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by sojustask
    I've already posted articles (one here) that show that the president acted on information he was given too hastily. It wasn't verified as true and did NOT come from a reliable source, that the information came from a KNOWN liar who says he told the story to escape torture.

    So, I guess we will keep saying it because it's true.

    Lady Mod
    Rove thought that Bush could slither out of culpability for the lies by hanging the onus of it on their torture victims. These vicious, Machiavellian criminals are far worse and loathsome than simple liars.
    In fact, they give liars a bad name.
    Last edited by dante; 12-27-2005 at 11:40 PM.

  8. #8
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Richmond, Texas
    Posts
    51

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by dante
    Rove thought that Bush could slither out of culpability for the lies by hanging the onus of it on their torture victims. These vicious, Machiavellian criminals are far worse and loathsome than simple liars.
    In fact, they give liars a bad name.
    Why don't you list the accusations of Bush lies, one by one, and let's address them systematically.

  9. #9
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    Aug 2004
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    280

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by jmclaughtx
    Why don't you list the accusations of Bush lies, one by one, and let's address them systematically.
    I will help you out here.

    We have already talked about them but they will not admit.

    1. Bush Lied.

    2. Bush Lied

    3. Bush Lied.

    4.Bush Lied.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Dec 2005
    Location
    Richmond, Texas
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    Re: Lets talk numbers

    I would like to see the response though, because by his apparent logic and I do not know what his opinion is based on, I would have to assume that the list of liars would have to include the following members of our government.

    Bill & Hillary Clinton
    Chuck Schumer
    Al Gore
    John Kerry
    John Edwards
    Nancy Pelosi
    Barbara Boxer
    Jane Harmon
    Tom Dashcle
    and even from the centrist democrats that I like such as John Breaux and Joe Lieberman.

    You get the drift of where this is heading so I can stop the list here even though this is the short version.

  11. #11
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    633

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    jmclaughtx,

    Far left Liberals and a fair majority of REAL liberals (from another thread) as well as a majority of Democrats do not honestly care what causes a Republican to be brought down, they simply want them out of power.

    It is not important to try to prove anything for two reasons; either he didn't lie or the leaders they look up to lied as well. Neither is good for gaining power back so it is much better to simply say he did and leave it at that.

  12. #12
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    Feb 2005
    Posts
    12,866

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by RegulationE
    jmclaughtx,

    Far left Liberals and a fair majority of REAL liberals (from another thread) as well as a majority of Democrats do not honestly care what causes a Republican to be brought down, they simply want them out of power.

    It is not important to try to prove anything for two reasons; either he didn't lie or the leaders they look up to lied as well. Neither is good for gaining power back so it is much better to simply say he did and leave it at that.
    And some don't even care that he's a Republican, they would feel the same way if he was a Democrat. :D

    You forgot that part.

    Hey they are politicians, THEY ALL LIE. GET RID OF ALL OF THEM.

    Namaste'

    Lady Mod

  13. #13
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    27,503

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    Quote Originally Posted by hdmarketing
    This is to all you out there who are crying about how many troops and that have been killed in Iraq.

    Yes you "Human Rights" activists that are running around calling Bush a "Mass Murderer".

    Yes YOU!

    Lets look at this shall we?

    According to this CNN Special Report http://www.cnn.com/SPECIALS/2003/ira...es/casualties/

    There have been a total of 4,725 deaths as of December 26, 2005.

    Quote

    There have been 2,363 coalition deaths, 2,164 Americans, one Australian, 98 Britons, 13 Bulgarians, two Danes, two Dutch, two Estonians, one Hungarian, 26 Italians, one Kazakh, one Latvian, 17 Poles, one Salvadoran, three Slovaks, 11 Spaniards, two Thai and 18 Ukrainians in the war in Iraq as of December 26, 2005, according to a CNN count.

    Now according to THIS in the NEWS
    http://news.yahoo.com/s/ap/20051227/ap_on_re_mi_ea/iraq
    Another Mass Grave has been found in Iraq.

    [B]Quote[/B]

    BAGHDAD, Iraq - Municipal workers in the Shiite holy city of Karbala found remains believed to be from a mass grave dating to 1991, when Saddam Hussein's regime put down a Shiite uprising in the south.

    Also, more than 10,000 people marched through Baghdad in support of a national unity government of Sunnis and Shiites, while insurgent attacks killed six Iraqi policemen and two civilians in a fresh surge of violence.

    The remains were discovered Monday and were sent for testing Tuesday in an effort to identify the bodies, said Rahman Mashawy, a Karbala police spokesman. He did not say how many bodies were found, and the police claim could not be independently verified.

    Human rights organizations estimate that more than 300,000 people, mainly Kurds and Shiite Muslims, were killed and buried in mass graves during Saddam's 23-year rule, which ended when U.S.-led forces toppled his regime in 2003. Saddam and seven co-defendants are now on trial for the deaths of more than 140 Shiites after a 1982 attempt on Saddam's life in the town of Dujail, north of Baghdad.


    300,000 people in 23 years, means an avarage of 13,043 people a year killed by Saddam.
    4,725 people since the Iraq war has began is not even close to this number.

    Ohhh but all I see is how Bush was a murderer, but yet Saddam killed more people in 1 year than the entire time of war in Iraq, and no one says anything about it?

    What's wrong with this picture?

    one word..........bushlovesjesus.......WHAT A LIAR.........HUH!!course we cant PROVE IT!!you wanna try!?hehe!!

  14. #14
    Join Date
    Feb 2005
    Posts
    12,866

    Re: Lets talk numbers

    844 in U.S. Military Killed in Iraq in 2005
    By DEXTER FILKINS

    BAGHDAD, Iraq, Dec. 31 - At least 844 American service members were killed in Iraq in 2005, nearly matching 2004's total of 848, according to information released by the United States government and a nonprofit organization that tracks casualties in Iraq.

    The deaths of two Americans announced by the United States military on Friday - a marine killed by gunfire in Falluja and a soldier killed by a roadside bomb in Baghdad - brought the total killed since the war in Iraq began in March 2003 to 2,178. The total wounded since the war began is 15,955.

    From Jan. 1, 2005 to Dec. 3, 2005, the most recent date for which numbers are available, the number of Americans military personnel wounded in Iraq was 5,557. The total wounded in 2004 was 7,989.

    In 2005, the single bloodiest month for American soldiers and marines was January, when 107 were killed and nearly 500 were wounded. At the time, American forces were conducting numerous operations to secure the country for the elections on Jan. 30. The second worst month was October, when 96 Americans were killed and 603 wounded.

    More than half of all 2005 American military deaths, 427, were caused by homemade bombs, most planted along roadsides and detonated as vehicles passed. American commanders have said that roadside bombs, the leading cause of death in Iraq, have grown larger and more sophisticated. Many are set off by remote detonators and are powerful enough to destroy heavily armored tanks and troop carriers.

    The totals were compiled by Iraq Coalition Casualty Count, a nonprofit group that tracks American service members killed and wounded in Iraq. The Associated Press, which keeps its own statistics, reported the year's death toll as slightly lower, saying that 841 had been killed.

    Death totals for Iraqis have been more difficult to estimate, and vary widely. Iraq Body Count, an independent media-monitoring group, estimates that about 30,000 Iraqis have died since the war began in 2003.

    On Saturday, violence flared across Iraq. In Khalis, north of Baghdad, a bomb killed five members of the Iraqi Islamic Party, a Sunni political party that defied insurgent threats and fielded candidates in the Dec. 15 election. Since 2003, at least 75 party members have been killed.

    In central Baghdad, a roadside bomb struck an Iraqi police patrol, killing two officers.

    At Camp Victory, the American military headquarters just outside Baghdad, Gen. Peter Pace, the chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff, urged Iraqi political leaders on Saturday to form a new government as quickly as possible to avoid the kind of delay that stalled the political momentum after the vote last January.

    "Clearly, the sooner that they're able to come to agreement on who their leaders are going to be, the sooner that those leaders then can act to appoint the rest of the country's key leadership," General Pace told reporters traveling with him on a troop visit.

    In historical terms, the number of casualties in Iraq is still relatively small. At the height of the Vietnam War, the American military was sustaining 500 killed and wounded each week. At the Battle of the Somme in 1916, about 58,000 British soldiers were killed or wounded on the first day.

    In interviews, American commanders have said the relatively unchanging number of deaths in Iraq from 2004 to 2005 belies the progress that had been made here against the guerrilla insurgency and in setting up democratic institutions. Three nationwide votes were held this year.

    Although the number of attacks against American and Iraqi forces in and around Baghdad has grown over the past year - to about 28 per day now from about 22 a year ago - only about 10 percent of those attacks inflict casualties, said Maj. Gen. William G. Webster Jr., the commander of American forces in and around Baghdad.

    A year ago, about 25 percent of attacks inflicted casualties.

    More than 400 car and suicide bombs struck the country in 2005, although the number has dropped sharply in recent months. In April, for instance, there were 66 suicide and car bomb attacks, compared with 28 in November.

    Eric Schmitt contributed reporting from Camp Victory, Iraq, for this article, and an Iraqi employee of The New York Times contributed from Baghdad.

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