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  1. #1
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    The War Against Christmas

    Conservatives Are Right to Fight Back Against War on Christmas

    by Don Feder
    Posted Dec 24, 2005

    There is no war on Christmas -- so says the secular left as it fires off another salvo.

    Of course, these are the same shameless ideologues who tell us with a perfectly straight face:

    There is no war on marriage -- as they go about busily trying to deconstruct an institution that serves as the bedrock of society and create an obscene parody called gay marriage, which would open the door to government sanction of polygamy and pedophilia.

    There's no war on parental rights -- all the while they're sexualizing your children (through the public schools), distributing condoms to adolescents and then, when she gets pregnant, providing an abortion for your 15-year-old daughter, without your knowledge or consent.

    There is no war on faith -- despite the fact that they're demolishing Ten Commandments monuments, want to take "one nation under God" out of the Pledge of Allegiance, remove "in God we trust," from our coinage and currency, and stop public prayer at the nation's military academies.

    There is no media bias -- even though the mainstream media blathers endlessly about the "religious right," but refuses to acknowledge the existence of a religious left.
    But, I digress.

    In response to growing public outrage over efforts to purge Christmas from our culture, liberals offer the following rebuttals: 1) Bill O'Reilly invented the whole thing as a publicity stunt, 2) The war on Christmas is a myth concocted by groups like American Family Association and Alliance Defense Fund to raise money from the unwary, and/or 3) It's part of a religious-right conspiracy to advance a theocratic agenda.

    In an opinion column in the December 4 New York Times -- "This Season's War Cry: Commercialize Christmas, or Else" -- Adam Cohen says religious conservatives suffer from schizophrenia. In years past, they complained about the commercialization of Christmas. Now, they're the ones trying to commercialize it, by pressuring retail establishments to say "Merry Christmas," Cohen maintains.

    And how exactly do the words "Merry Christmas" commercialize the holiday?

    You're already at the checkout counter. You've spent your hard-earned money. All we're looking for is a recognition of the reality that 9 out of 10 shoppers aren't buying presents for Kwanza, or Hanukah or the Winter Solstice.

    Yes, but censoring the word "Christmas" is sensitive, Cohen claims. "For decades, companies have replaced 'Christmas parties' with 'holiday parties,' schools and stores have used phrases like 'Happy Holidays' and 'Seasons Greeting' out of respect for the nation's diversity."

    There it is, the secular left's ace-up-the-sleeve -- the diversity card.

    But the nation is far more homogenous than diversity-mavens would have us believe. America is 85% Christian. (And 96% of us celebrate Christmas.) They don't say "Have a Happy Holiday" in Israel at Hanukah, though a third of the nation isn't Jewish. They don't say "Seasons Greetings" in Egypt, when Ramadan rolls around.

    Why must America be the only nation on earth that refuses to acknowledge its religious roots? Why must we be the only nation to studiously ignore the majority's faith?

    But there's something much darker at work here, Cohen discloses, "The Christmas that Mr. O'Reilly and his allies are promoting ... fits with their campaign to make America more like a theocracy, with Christian displays on public property and Christian prayer in public schools."

    If you can't plausibly accuse someone of being a theocrat, say they're more like a theocrat. Clearly, no one in their right mind believes that a Nativity scene in a public park or a non-denominational prayer in the public schools equals 15th century Spain or modern-day Iran.

    So, you know, "more like a theocracy" -- the kind of theocracy which contents itself with voluntary measures and symbolic gestures, the kind of theocracy America was circa 1962.

    If -- as the left contends -- conservative Christians invented the war on Christmas to move us down the road to a theocratic state, which religion will hold the reins of power -- the Catholicism of Bill Donohue of the Catholic League, the Methodism of Don Wildmon (head of the American Family Association) or the Judaism of Jackie Mason and Rabbi Aryeh Spero, who stood with me on the steps of St. Patrick's Cathedral last week to denounce efforts to purge Christmas from the culture?

    Or, perhaps we'll have an historic first -- a diversity theocracy?

    Writing on the Washington-insider website Salon.com ("How the secular humanist grinch didn't steal Christmas"), Michelle Goldberg insists: "In fact, there is no war on Christmas. What there is, rather, is a burgeoning myth of a war on Christmas, assembled out of old reactionary tropes, urban legends, exaggerated anecdotes, and increasingly organized hostility to the American Civil Liberties Union."

    Yeah, like us old reactionaries really have to work at getting ordinary Americans to despise the Boy Scout-baiting, religion-hating, terrorist-friendly ACLU.

    Fran Quigly, executive director of the Indiana ACLU, agrees that his group is under siege. Hype about a war on Christmas is the product of "a well-organized attempt by extremist groups to demonize the ACLU, crush religious diversity and make a few bucks in the process."

    So, when the mayor of Boston attempted to rename the city's Christmas tree a "holiday tree," was news of same a reactionary trope, an exaggerated anecdote or an urban legend? And Atlanta's "Grand Tree," Purdue University's "Union Tree" and the U.S. Naval Academy's "Giving Tree" -- more urban mythology?

    How about the Housing Resource Development Corporation in Winter Park, Fla., which told the elderly residents of a nursing home it operates that they can't sing Christmas carols, or the public housing authority in Mechanicsburg, Pa., which instructed residents of a project for low-income seniors not to put up Christmas decorations in the building's common areas? More exaggerated reports from a war that doesn't exist?

    New York City's Environmental Protection Agency allows employees to put up Hanukkah banners and celebrate the Hindu festival of Diwali, but has banned red and green decorations and even removed "holiday trees" (lest they be mistaken for the dreaded Christmas tree). In Diversity America, every religion gets a seat at the table, except the faith adhered to by 85% of the American people.

    If space permitted, I could offer hundreds -- nay, thousands -- of such urban anecdotes and exaggerated myths -- doubtless, all dreamed up by the religious right to generate donations and "Christianize" America.

    In fact, so successful are O'Reilly and other war-on-Christmas-mongers, that they've managed to get most Americans to buy in to the myth.

    When a November FOX News poll asked respondents "Do you feel like Christianity is under attack in the United States today?" -- 59% answered "yes." When the Anti-Defamation League re-phrased the question slightly (Do you think "religion is under attack" in America), 64% agreed.

    Yes, Virginia, there is a war on Christmas. We don't need "The O'Reilly Factor" or the Alliance Defense Fund to tell us about it -- though they've done a good job of documenting it.

    The casualties are everywhere. The aggression is so blatant that only the ideologically deluded could deny its existence.

    The effort to drive Christmas underground is part of a much broader campaign to eliminate the influence of the vestiges of Judeo-Christian morality.

    Public celebrations or acknowledgements of Christmas remind Americans of our religious heritage. They also contradict the myth that America is a mosaic. America has a religion. For the overwhelming majority of Americans, it's Christianity. Christmas celebrates the birth of its founder.

    Christianity is all that stands in the way of the left's cherished goals -- to make America like Europe (whose leaders can't even acknowledge the continent's Christian heritage in the proposed constitution for the European Union), like Sweden (that almost imprisoned a pastor for preaching the Biblical view of homosexuality), like the Netherlands (that has legalized euthanasia, prostitution, group marriage and drugs), like France (whose natives have negative population growth which, when combined with open-borders and generous welfare benefits, is creating an Islamic republic of the future), like -- San Francisco, Times Square and Berkeley all rolled into one.

    Christian activists proved their effectiveness with successful referenda campaigns for marriage -- from Ohio to California. To put it in World War II-terms, Christian conservatives are the RAF that must be swept from the skies by the left's Luftwaffe for elitists to achieve total dominance of the culture.

    Conservatives weren't the ones who turned Christmas into a front in the culture war. And we're not about to apologize for fighting back.

    This commentary originally appeared on GrassTopsUSA.com.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Copyright © 2005 HUMAN EVENTS. All Rights Reserved.

  2. #2
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    First, you are OF COURSE entitled to your opinions, as everyone else on this forum is. But, I felt the need to give voice to simply a more peaceful and less condemning message at this season. I am also not posting this reply to get into a battle with anyone. This is just another, I think, more enlightened opinion. This season, after all, should bring out the best in all of us. :)
    I fail to understand, and I believe any well-educated person would agree, how you can relate the acknowledgement of some sort of gay partners would open the flood gates to polygamy and PEDOPHILIA :confused: . I am not gay; I am a very straight 40 year old female. Maybe calling it marriage is not the way to go but face it; there are gay people out there. What exactly is SO wrong with some kind of way for them to have a legal commitment to each other? As I said, I am straight and I am confident in my sexual orientation and I don't feel the least bit threatened by gay people being given some rights. As far as the religious end of it goes, I am not really concerned about that either. If God does punish gay people for being gay, that would be between Him and them. You are sitting in judgment when you espouse those kinds of views and if you are really up on your Christianity, you would know that is NOT your judgment to make.
    As far as giving condoms to teenagers goes, your opinion is completely out of step with the realities. No, we don’t want our children having sex but, do you think they deserve to DIE because they did? By condemning the availability to condoms, that is what you are advocating. Also, you are against the distribution of condoms to minors but you are also apparently against abortion. That is exactly what we all need, more children born to children. Please people, just face the facts! You don’t have to approve, encourage or legitimize children having sex but the fact is that some of them WILL and they don’t deserve to DIE from a terrible AIDS-related disease because they did. As far as abortion itself goes, I am not even going to get into that argument. You are clearly conservative and that is your right. I am clearly female and unfortunately I wasn’t able (due to medical problems) to have children. I think that gives me even more of a right to comment on this subject. My mother took medication for morning sickness (that her doctor prescribed) when she was pregnant with me and because of that I have had “female” problems all of my life. I would have loved to have children but couldn’t, still I believe that it is a woman’s decision. I do NOT believe it should be used as a means of birth control and I would be totally okay with limits being established. A woman should not be allowed to have abortion after abortion after abortion. However, abortion should continue to be a legal option for women (especially in cases of rape, incest or when it would risk the mother’s life). I notice that a lot of the people who are pro-lifers are also men. If you will permit me, I cannot resist a bit of sarcasm here. Why don’t we just take away women’s right to the vote as well? Why don’t we American women start walking ten steps behind our men and wear coverings from head-to-toe? I have a feeling that if men could get pregnant this wouldn’t be such a controversial issue.

    My grandfather fought in WWII. He landed on the beach at Normandy on D-day. My mother was two years old before he ever saw her. The boys and men that fought in that war did so for this country. This country was founded on principles of freedom of life, love and religion. Those things are NOT to be legislated or regulated by ANYONE. America and its citizens are not perfect but, in my opinion, we have it as good as or better than anyone or anywhere else. That brings to mind the old quote “America Love It OR Leave It!! I don’t agree with all of our laws. I don’t think anyone should be able to tell me I have to wear a seatbelt. The only one hurt by my decision to wear or not to wear a seatbelt would be me and that should be my choice. However, like I said, it’s better here than anywhere else.

    I have one last comment regarding your statistics. I have no idea where you come up with those. My thought is that these are primarily your estimations (this country is 85% Christian?). Well I am, but I don’t know about 85%?!? 96% of us celebrate Christmas? My family and I do and most of the people I know but, 96% sounds like a bit of an exaggeration. I mean there are a lot of groups in this country that I know do NOT celebrate Christmas, just to name a few the Jewish, Atheists, Arabs, Jehovah’s Witnesses, Japanese, the list goes on.

    Anyway, like I said, this is not meant to be an argument. These are just my opinions, some fact and some reality. Face it, America is a melting pot. It was intended to be from the beginning. That is exactly why our forefathers had the good sense and the foresight to separate church and state. If you ask me, which I know no one has, that is why we are having these debates. It seems that the lines between the two get blurred. In order to keep America the strong, proud, great country she has always been, this separation is of the utmost importance.

    I leave you with a parting thought. All of the wars ever fought have primarily been started over diverse views in religion. When it comes down to it most of us believe in a higher being. I don’t think God really cares what you call him as long as you do. I don’t understand why we have to have wars about it. I don’t believe God would be impressed with our performance (and I mean all of mankind) in this area. You believe in what and who you want to believe and let me and everyone else do the same. If you are right and everyone else is wrong you will win in the end without ever having thrown a punch or fired a bullet. There, solved. See. God is not going to single out and punish you for the sins of others. Peace and love to all of you. If all of us get up everyday and be the best we can, the world will be a better place.

    Merry Christmas and Happy Holidays!!

  3. #3
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    "There is no war on marriage -- as they go about busily trying to deconstruct an institution that serves as the bedrock of society and create an obscene parody called gay marriage, which would open the door to government sanction of polygamy and pedophilia."

    If you're so concerned about protecting marriage then why not work to do away with the "no fault divorce" laws that we now have in place. It takes the consent of two people to get married, it only takes the decision of one to break the marriage up. I find it interesting that so many conservative, family-values christians are also working on their second and third marriages. I don't see any move in congress to really protect marriage by restricting divorce or to make people work harder to preserve it. You really want to protect marriage then make divorce much harder. Reagan signed the no-fault divorce when he was governor of California. The rest of the country followed suit. Why punish your fellow humans for their sexuality? People are born gay, it's not a lifestyle choice any more than the color of ones skin is a choice. Perhaps if we give gay people tax breaks for not being allowed to fully participate in society it might change your mind. If they can't be full citizens with full rights then they shouldn't have to pay the same amount of taxes. If they want their relationships to be recognised then why do you feel it's your right to punish and marginalize them? By making them second-class citizens you are saying that they are not human. Denying people the right to have their relationships legally recognized won't protect marriage one whit it only punishes people for a condition they can't help having.

    "There's no war on parental rights -- all the while they're sexualizing your children (through the public schools), distributing condoms to adolescents and then, when she gets pregnant, providing an abortion for your 15-year-old daughter, without your knowledge or consent."

    I can't see where there is a war on your rights. Public schools? Then home school your children or send them to a religious school of your choice where they can be indoctrinated the way you want. What about some fundamentalist groups who think poligamy is ok? Do you think it's right to force your 14 year old daughter to marry a 70 year old man? What about those who think incest is ok because Lot had sex with his two daughters and impregated them? If you have a good, honest relationship with your children you probably won't have a problem with them. I was very open with my kids regarding sex ed. I really impressed them with being responsible and mature in their decisions. They were taught the truth and given medical facts not garbage. Both my children grew up responsible, well-educated people. Yes, they knew all about condoms and birth control. As a nurse I knew that you could encourage your children but there would be times when temptation could and would overwhelm them. I'd rather my child knew how to protect themselves then to have a baby before they were ready or to contract a STD. I made it very clear that there wouldn't be any lame excuses for not being responsible.

    "There is no war on faith -- despite the fact that they're demolishing Ten Commandments monuments, want to take "one nation under God" out of the Pledge of Allegiance, remove "in God we trust," from our coinage and currency, and stop public prayer at the nation's military academies."

    The under God part wasn't added until 1954 so does that mean that all those Americans prior to 1954 were less patriotic? Amazing that the guys who fought WWII didn't have "under God" in their pledge yet they managed to fight a war to save the worlds' backside. Our country managed to grow and prosper inspite of no "under God" so I really can't see the problem. I wish you and others like you would place more emphasis on the "indivisable" rather than the "under God". Our country is being divided more and more everyday because of this bogus attitude that somehow your religious, parental, and political rights are being taken away from you. Have your children been taken away from you? Have you been denied the right to vote? Has the police come and locked the doors to your chuch lately? Have the authorites come and searched your home for items not considered politically correct? No yet you feel that somehow because there are a majority of Americans out there who don't aggree with you that your "rights" are being infringed upon. What nonsense!



    "There is no media bias -- even though the mainstream media blathers endlessly about the "religious right," but refuses to acknowledge the existence of a religious left."

    I'd be curious to know what you consider the "religious left"? Jesus was considered too liberal in his day so I guess I'm in good company.
    Well, I hear this complaint all the time so I have to come to the conclusion that anything not like Fox news, Rush Limbaugh, ect that isn't blathering 24/7 as to why we should all march lockstep in the conservative political/religious belief system makes us haters of America and not far enough to the right. I'm sick of hearing it. I'm sick of being accused of being something less than human because I disagree with you and your beliefs. So long as you aren't being hauled away to a concentration camp I really can't see why you complain. You freely express yourself, you worship the way you choose, you vote the way you wish. No one forces you to listen to any media that you don't like. I can't stand any of the rightwing talk shows so I don't listen to them but I'm not demanding that it be removed from the airways so you can't listen. It's called self-responsibilty. Take a lesson from the Amish or Mennonites. They protect their children by living among likeminded people. They don't have tv's or radios. Perhaps you should consider founding a community where you can live with other like minded people so you don't have to worry about any influences you consider unhealthy or too liberal.
    There are children living out in the streets because their parents can't afford a home even though they have full time jobs. It's not just the holidays that they need food and shelter. Why don't you concentrate on those who need help rather than perpetuating this bogus "war" on your attitudes. Do you really want this country to be the religious rights version of the Soviet Union? One political party, one religion? I don't.

  4. #4
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    "War on Christmas"...What a load of ****e. It's the "Fox News Generated War on Christmas" with Bull O'Really as it General. The notion is BS. What small issues have all been blown out of porportion to generate headlines and ratings. For some reason Christians, right-wing Christians believe they have the rights to the season regardless of other faiths having their own holy times at this time of the year.

    Wake up and smell the coffee!

  5. #5
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Quote Originally Posted by boone
    Conservatives Are Right to Fight Back Against War on Christmas

    by Don Feder
    Posted Dec 24, 2005

    There is no war on Christmas -- so says the secular left as it fires off another salvo.

    Of course, these are the same shameless ideologues who tell us with a perfectly straight face:

    There is no war on marriage -- as they go about busily trying to deconstruct an institution that serves as the bedrock of society and create an obscene parody called gay marriage, which would open the door to government sanction of polygamy and pedophilia.

    There's no war on parental rights -- all the while they're sexualizing your children (through the public schools), distributing condoms to adolescents and then, when she gets pregnant, providing an abortion for your 15-year-old daughter, without your knowledge or consent.

    There is no war on faith -- despite the fact that they're demolishing Ten Commandments monuments, want to take "one nation under God" out of the Pledge of Allegiance, remove "in God we trust," from our coinage and currency, and stop public prayer at the nation's military academies.

    There is no media bias -- even though the mainstream media blathers endlessly about the "religious right," but refuses to acknowledge the existence of a religious left.
    But, I digress.

    In response to growing public outrage over efforts to purge Christmas from our culture, liberals offer the following rebuttals: 1) Bill O'Reilly invented the whole thing as a publicity stunt, 2) The war on Christmas is a myth concocted by groups like American Family Association and Alliance Defense Fund to raise money from the unwary, and/or 3) It's part of a religious-right conspiracy to advance a theocratic agenda.

    In an opinion column in the December 4 New York Times -- "This Season's War Cry: Commercialize Christmas, or Else" -- Adam Cohen says religious conservatives suffer from schizophrenia. In years past, they complained about the commercialization of Christmas. Now, they're the ones trying to commercialize it, by pressuring retail establishments to say "Merry Christmas," Cohen maintains.

    And how exactly do the words "Merry Christmas" commercialize the holiday?

    You're already at the checkout counter. You've spent your hard-earned money. All we're looking for is a recognition of the reality that 9 out of 10 shoppers aren't buying presents for Kwanza, or Hanukah or the Winter Solstice.

    Yes, but censoring the word "Christmas" is sensitive, Cohen claims. "For decades, companies have replaced 'Christmas parties' with 'holiday parties,' schools and stores have used phrases like 'Happy Holidays' and 'Seasons Greeting' out of respect for the nation's diversity."

    There it is, the secular left's ace-up-the-sleeve -- the diversity card.

    But the nation is far more homogenous than diversity-mavens would have us believe. America is 85% Christian. (And 96% of us celebrate Christmas.) They don't say "Have a Happy Holiday" in Israel at Hanukah, though a third of the nation isn't Jewish. They don't say "Seasons Greetings" in Egypt, when Ramadan rolls around.

    Why must America be the only nation on earth that refuses to acknowledge its religious roots? Why must we be the only nation to studiously ignore the majority's faith?

    But there's something much darker at work here, Cohen discloses, "The Christmas that Mr. O'Reilly and his allies are promoting ... fits with their campaign to make America more like a theocracy, with Christian displays on public property and Christian prayer in public schools."

    If you can't plausibly accuse someone of being a theocrat, say they're more like a theocrat. Clearly, no one in their right mind believes that a Nativity scene in a public park or a non-denominational prayer in the public schools equals 15th century Spain or modern-day Iran.

    So, you know, "more like a theocracy" -- the kind of theocracy which contents itself with voluntary measures and symbolic gestures, the kind of theocracy America was circa 1962.

    If -- as the left contends -- conservative Christians invented the war on Christmas to move us down the road to a theocratic state, which religion will hold the reins of power -- the Catholicism of Bill Donohue of the Catholic League, the Methodism of Don Wildmon (head of the American Family Association) or the Judaism of Jackie Mason and Rabbi Aryeh Spero, who stood with me on the steps of St. Patrick's Cathedral last week to denounce efforts to purge Christmas from the culture?

    Or, perhaps we'll have an historic first -- a diversity theocracy?

    Writing on the Washington-insider website Salon.com ("How the secular humanist grinch didn't steal Christmas"), Michelle Goldberg insists: "In fact, there is no war on Christmas. What there is, rather, is a burgeoning myth of a war on Christmas, assembled out of old reactionary tropes, urban legends, exaggerated anecdotes, and increasingly organized hostility to the American Civil Liberties Union."

    Yeah, like us old reactionaries really have to work at getting ordinary Americans to despise the Boy Scout-baiting, religion-hating, terrorist-friendly ACLU.

    Fran Quigly, executive director of the Indiana ACLU, agrees that his group is under siege. Hype about a war on Christmas is the product of "a well-organized attempt by extremist groups to demonize the ACLU, crush religious diversity and make a few bucks in the process."

    So, when the mayor of Boston attempted to rename the city's Christmas tree a "holiday tree," was news of same a reactionary trope, an exaggerated anecdote or an urban legend? And Atlanta's "Grand Tree," Purdue University's "Union Tree" and the U.S. Naval Academy's "Giving Tree" -- more urban mythology?

    How about the Housing Resource Development Corporation in Winter Park, Fla., which told the elderly residents of a nursing home it operates that they can't sing Christmas carols, or the public housing authority in Mechanicsburg, Pa., which instructed residents of a project for low-income seniors not to put up Christmas decorations in the building's common areas? More exaggerated reports from a war that doesn't exist?

    New York City's Environmental Protection Agency allows employees to put up Hanukkah banners and celebrate the Hindu festival of Diwali, but has banned red and green decorations and even removed "holiday trees" (lest they be mistaken for the dreaded Christmas tree). In Diversity America, every religion gets a seat at the table, except the faith adhered to by 85% of the American people.

    If space permitted, I could offer hundreds -- nay, thousands -- of such urban anecdotes and exaggerated myths -- doubtless, all dreamed up by the religious right to generate donations and "Christianize" America.

    In fact, so successful are O'Reilly and other war-on-Christmas-mongers, that they've managed to get most Americans to buy in to the myth.

    When a November FOX News poll asked respondents "Do you feel like Christianity is under attack in the United States today?" -- 59% answered "yes." When the Anti-Defamation League re-phrased the question slightly (Do you think "religion is under attack" in America), 64% agreed.

    Yes, Virginia, there is a war on Christmas. We don't need "The O'Reilly Factor" or the Alliance Defense Fund to tell us about it -- though they've done a good job of documenting it.

    The casualties are everywhere. The aggression is so blatant that only the ideologically deluded could deny its existence.

    The effort to drive Christmas underground is part of a much broader campaign to eliminate the influence of the vestiges of Judeo-Christian morality.

    Public celebrations or acknowledgements of Christmas remind Americans of our religious heritage. They also contradict the myth that America is a mosaic. America has a religion. For the overwhelming majority of Americans, it's Christianity. Christmas celebrates the birth of its founder.

    Christianity is all that stands in the way of the left's cherished goals -- to make America like Europe (whose leaders can't even acknowledge the continent's Christian heritage in the proposed constitution for the European Union), like Sweden (that almost imprisoned a pastor for preaching the Biblical view of homosexuality), like the Netherlands (that has legalized euthanasia, prostitution, group marriage and drugs), like France (whose natives have negative population growth which, when combined with open-borders and generous welfare benefits, is creating an Islamic republic of the future), like -- San Francisco, Times Square and Berkeley all rolled into one.

    Christian activists proved their effectiveness with successful referenda campaigns for marriage -- from Ohio to California. To put it in World War II-terms, Christian conservatives are the RAF that must be swept from the skies by the left's Luftwaffe for elitists to achieve total dominance of the culture.

    Conservatives weren't the ones who turned Christmas into a front in the culture war. And we're not about to apologize for fighting back.

    This commentary originally appeared on GrassTopsUSA.com.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Copyright © 2005 HUMAN EVENTS. All Rights Reserved.

    so ya quoted some paid right wing *****........so what!?what's "YOUR" point!?

  6. #6
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    That a bunch of it is urban myths? I know the thing about not letting old people in retirement homes put up decorations or sing Christmas carols is--I checked.

    Sheesh, even here someone put a Christmas tree in the lobby. Lemme see--the co-op is about 50% Buddhist, 30% Islamic, 20% Hindu, plus two Christians--and yours truly the Jew.

    Who cares? Just don't burn the house down!

    Maybe the point is that Americans are a little....loopy?
    Last edited by ComplexKid; 12-30-2005 at 08:04 AM.

  7. #7
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Boone - I thoroughly enjoyed your post - and it gave me food for thought. I really did experience the push to erase "Christmas" especially in the media this year. It had been subtle in the past few years - but like "a brick in the head" this year. I think I know how to turn the tide. It won't be easy, but the answer is quite simple - hit the retailers. Many businesses just tread water until the next holiday. If you tell two people and I tell two people, and so on, and so on....Let's go back to the real meaning of Christmas...don't max the credit card - small gifts...we have nearly a whole year to sell this idea! It doesn't even need to be that extreme - say people give just a little more cash to any charity (and a few less gifts).....no tax for the feds....no money for walmart. Does anyone even remember what "BOXING DAY" is about? (my kids are gonna roll their eyes at our next family meeting.. I thank you for that... and moan "why did we ever teach her how to use the internet!!) I hope you and yours had a Very Merry Christmas Boone!

  8. #8
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Quote Originally Posted by linda49
    Boone - I thoroughly enjoyed your post - and it gave me food for thought. I really did experience the push to erase "Christmas" especially in the media this year. It had been subtle in the past few years - but like "a brick in the head" this year. I think I know how to turn the tide. It won't be easy, but the answer is quite simple - hit the retailers. Many businesses just tread water until the next holiday. If you tell two people and I tell two people, and so on, and so on....Let's go back to the real meaning of Christmas...don't max the credit card - small gifts...we have nearly a whole year to sell this idea! It doesn't even need to be that extreme - say people give just a little more cash to any charity (and a few less gifts).....no tax for the feds....no money for walmart. Does anyone even remember what "BOXING DAY" is about? (my kids are gonna roll their eyes at our next family meeting.. I thank you for that... and moan "why did we ever teach her how to use the internet!!) I hope you and yours had a Very Merry Christmas Boone!
    have a merry Xmas boone f u c k the rest of em!?...so your a right wing smuck all caught up in the anti anti this and that of whatever and give credit to boony when he is quoting another source like a suckup ho the 2 of ya!?hehe!!have a nice Xmas!!hehe!!and speakin of the internet!when you leavin it!?(per your own advice!?)hehe!!just kiddin!!have a nice new years!!ya'll!!i'm really a nice guy once ya get to know me!!just ask around!?hehe!!
    Last edited by lexx; 12-30-2005 at 01:43 PM.

  9. #9
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Quote Originally Posted by boone
    Conservatives Are Right to Fight Back Against War on Christmas

    by Don Feder
    Posted Dec 24, 2005

    There is no war on Christmas -- so says the secular left as it fires off another salvo.

    Of course, these are the same shameless ideologues who tell us with a perfectly straight face:

    There is no war on marriage -- as they go about busily trying to deconstruct an institution that serves as the bedrock of society and create an obscene parody called gay marriage, which would open the door to government sanction of polygamy and pedophilia.

    There's no war on parental rights -- all the while they're sexualizing your children (through the public schools), distributing condoms to adolescents and then, when she gets pregnant, providing an abortion for your 15-year-old daughter, without your knowledge or consent.

    There is no war on faith -- despite the fact that they're demolishing Ten Commandments monuments, want to take "one nation under God" out of the Pledge of Allegiance, remove "in God we trust," from our coinage and currency, and stop public prayer at the nation's military academies.

    There is no media bias -- even though the mainstream media blathers endlessly about the "religious right," but refuses to acknowledge the existence of a religious left.
    But, I digress.

    In response to growing public outrage over efforts to purge Christmas from our culture, liberals offer the following rebuttals: 1) Bill O'Reilly invented the whole thing as a publicity stunt, 2) The war on Christmas is a myth concocted by groups like American Family Association and Alliance Defense Fund to raise money from the unwary, and/or 3) It's part of a religious-right conspiracy to advance a theocratic agenda.

    In an opinion column in the December 4 New York Times -- "This Season's War Cry: Commercialize Christmas, or Else" -- Adam Cohen says religious conservatives suffer from schizophrenia. In years past, they complained about the commercialization of Christmas. Now, they're the ones trying to commercialize it, by pressuring retail establishments to say "Merry Christmas," Cohen maintains.

    And how exactly do the words "Merry Christmas" commercialize the holiday?

    You're already at the checkout counter. You've spent your hard-earned money. All we're looking for is a recognition of the reality that 9 out of 10 shoppers aren't buying presents for Kwanza, or Hanukah or the Winter Solstice.

    Yes, but censoring the word "Christmas" is sensitive, Cohen claims. "For decades, companies have replaced 'Christmas parties' with 'holiday parties,' schools and stores have used phrases like 'Happy Holidays' and 'Seasons Greeting' out of respect for the nation's diversity."

    There it is, the secular left's ace-up-the-sleeve -- the diversity card.

    But the nation is far more homogenous than diversity-mavens would have us believe. America is 85% Christian. (And 96% of us celebrate Christmas.) They don't say "Have a Happy Holiday" in Israel at Hanukah, though a third of the nation isn't Jewish. They don't say "Seasons Greetings" in Egypt, when Ramadan rolls around.

    Why must America be the only nation on earth that refuses to acknowledge its religious roots? Why must we be the only nation to studiously ignore the majority's faith?

    But there's something much darker at work here, Cohen discloses, "The Christmas that Mr. O'Reilly and his allies are promoting ... fits with their campaign to make America more like a theocracy, with Christian displays on public property and Christian prayer in public schools."

    If you can't plausibly accuse someone of being a theocrat, say they're more like a theocrat. Clearly, no one in their right mind believes that a Nativity scene in a public park or a non-denominational prayer in the public schools equals 15th century Spain or modern-day Iran.

    So, you know, "more like a theocracy" -- the kind of theocracy which contents itself with voluntary measures and symbolic gestures, the kind of theocracy America was circa 1962.

    If -- as the left contends -- conservative Christians invented the war on Christmas to move us down the road to a theocratic state, which religion will hold the reins of power -- the Catholicism of Bill Donohue of the Catholic League, the Methodism of Don Wildmon (head of the American Family Association) or the Judaism of Jackie Mason and Rabbi Aryeh Spero, who stood with me on the steps of St. Patrick's Cathedral last week to denounce efforts to purge Christmas from the culture?

    Or, perhaps we'll have an historic first -- a diversity theocracy?

    Writing on the Washington-insider website Salon.com ("How the secular humanist grinch didn't steal Christmas"), Michelle Goldberg insists: "In fact, there is no war on Christmas. What there is, rather, is a burgeoning myth of a war on Christmas, assembled out of old reactionary tropes, urban legends, exaggerated anecdotes, and increasingly organized hostility to the American Civil Liberties Union."

    Yeah, like us old reactionaries really have to work at getting ordinary Americans to despise the Boy Scout-baiting, religion-hating, terrorist-friendly ACLU.

    Fran Quigly, executive director of the Indiana ACLU, agrees that his group is under siege. Hype about a war on Christmas is the product of "a well-organized attempt by extremist groups to demonize the ACLU, crush religious diversity and make a few bucks in the process."

    So, when the mayor of Boston attempted to rename the city's Christmas tree a "holiday tree," was news of same a reactionary trope, an exaggerated anecdote or an urban legend? And Atlanta's "Grand Tree," Purdue University's "Union Tree" and the U.S. Naval Academy's "Giving Tree" -- more urban mythology?

    How about the Housing Resource Development Corporation in Winter Park, Fla., which told the elderly residents of a nursing home it operates that they can't sing Christmas carols, or the public housing authority in Mechanicsburg, Pa., which instructed residents of a project for low-income seniors not to put up Christmas decorations in the building's common areas? More exaggerated reports from a war that doesn't exist?

    New York City's Environmental Protection Agency allows employees to put up Hanukkah banners and celebrate the Hindu festival of Diwali, but has banned red and green decorations and even removed "holiday trees" (lest they be mistaken for the dreaded Christmas tree). In Diversity America, every religion gets a seat at the table, except the faith adhered to by 85% of the American people.

    If space permitted, I could offer hundreds -- nay, thousands -- of such urban anecdotes and exaggerated myths -- doubtless, all dreamed up by the religious right to generate donations and "Christianize" America.

    In fact, so successful are O'Reilly and other war-on-Christmas-mongers, that they've managed to get most Americans to buy in to the myth.

    When a November FOX News poll asked respondents "Do you feel like Christianity is under attack in the United States today?" -- 59% answered "yes." When the Anti-Defamation League re-phrased the question slightly (Do you think "religion is under attack" in America), 64% agreed.

    Yes, Virginia, there is a war on Christmas. We don't need "The O'Reilly Factor" or the Alliance Defense Fund to tell us about it -- though they've done a good job of documenting it.

    The casualties are everywhere. The aggression is so blatant that only the ideologically deluded could deny its existence.

    The effort to drive Christmas underground is part of a much broader campaign to eliminate the influence of the vestiges of Judeo-Christian morality.

    Public celebrations or acknowledgements of Christmas remind Americans of our religious heritage. They also contradict the myth that America is a mosaic. America has a religion. For the overwhelming majority of Americans, it's Christianity. Christmas celebrates the birth of its founder.

    Christianity is all that stands in the way of the left's cherished goals -- to make America like Europe (whose leaders can't even acknowledge the continent's Christian heritage in the proposed constitution for the European Union), like Sweden (that almost imprisoned a pastor for preaching the Biblical view of homosexuality), like the Netherlands (that has legalized euthanasia, prostitution, group marriage and drugs), like France (whose natives have negative population growth which, when combined with open-borders and generous welfare benefits, is creating an Islamic republic of the future), like -- San Francisco, Times Square and Berkeley all rolled into one.

    Christian activists proved their effectiveness with successful referenda campaigns for marriage -- from Ohio to California. To put it in World War II-terms, Christian conservatives are the RAF that must be swept from the skies by the left's Luftwaffe for elitists to achieve total dominance of the culture.

    Conservatives weren't the ones who turned Christmas into a front in the culture war. And we're not about to apologize for fighting back.

    This commentary originally appeared on GrassTopsUSA.com.

    --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

    Copyright © 2005 HUMAN EVENTS. All Rights Reserved.
    You whine and whine when you are unable to push your religious view on others.
    Enough already!!! You all want to wrap yourselves in Patriotism but, it's a patriotism defined by your faith and not the constitution. Right-wing conservative christians are like a rash on the skin of America.

  10. #10
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    I guess I can tell everyone that I am Jewish since it is especially appropriate. That is simply because I want to tell you all how proud I am to wish each and ever person a MERRY CHRISTMAS each year. It brings me such joy!

    MERRY CHRISTMAS! Got a problem with it?

  11. #11
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Not really but I'm Jewish too--do I get a 'happy Christmas' or a 'happy Hanukkah'?

    Cheers -
    CK

  12. #12
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Quote Originally Posted by Synik
    You whine and whine when you are unable to push your religious view on others.
    Enough already!!! You all want to wrap yourselves in Patriotism but, it's a patriotism defined by your faith and not the constitution. Right-wing conservative christians are like a rash on the skin of America.
    Well im Left Wing Liberal Christian and I agree with a lot what boone had to say above. I think your type whatever that may be has a problem with Christains in General. All I have ever seen from you is jumping in and out of Forums criticizing peoples beliefs.
    Thats very sad you think you would find a better use for your time.
    You dont need to be a Christain to see and understand boones stance on these issues. A lot of it is merely believing in God. You know the God in the Bible! Yea that one, you know our Father GOD the being that a lot of people keep casting out of their hearts. That GOD.
    war_on_scam

  13. #13
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Maybe when we took "Christ" out of Christmas and turned it into a holiday focused on buying gifts and parties, God left us up to our own devices and what you see now is merely a consequence of what our prior actions were. Every action has a reaction, every sin it's consequence.

    Christians for many, many years have allowed the celebration to get more and more commercialized. What did we really expect would eventually happen?

    Namaste'

    Lady Mod

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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Wow, what a mixed bag of replies here...typical debate, then, right? What's my point? There were a lot of valid points in the article...gives people something to think about and take action on, if they want...guess I struck a wrong chord with some people here...sorry! GOSH! But animosity and insults won't hurt me- nice try, and if I am what you call a RASH than I am proud to be one!

    In response also, I must ask, is that what these boards exist for: to push views on others? Then what's the point in that? I do not come to this site to get views pushed onto me, OR to push my views onto others, thank you very much- but to get info., share info. that I think will help, and stuff like that.

    I received an email a few weeks before Christmas pointing me to the article about two places that didn't allow anything Christmas- a nursing home, and a group home, I believe...there was a request to email or call the places and ask them to relent. I emailed the two places, and later got an up-date that one decided to recant and allow Christmas decorations, caroling, etc. I don't have the article or link anymore- I checked.

    To everybody: I hope your Christmas or Hanukkah (whatever applies) was a great one. I guess I better whine about something else since someone said that is what I am doing: John Lennon, Bing Crosby, and Elvis, to name a few, recorded beautiful songs about "Christmas" and no one got offended, or off-ended, i.e. bent out of shape about it...whaaaaaaa...it IS a different world now and they don't make 'em like that anymore...

  15. #15
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Why is it, Righ-Wing Christians feel they have a right to advance their religious beliefs on others?

  16. #16
    war_man's Avatar
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    Re: The War Against Christmas

    Quote Originally Posted by boone

    In response also, I must ask, is that what these boards exist for: to push views on others? Then what's the point in that? I do not come to this site to get views pushed onto me, OR to push my views onto others, thank you very much- but to get info., share info. that I think will help, and stuff like that.
    It a shame you cant have an opinion here without some idiot thinking that your trying to somehow separate them from their twisted way of thinking.
    I liked your view points on a great many things you said here in your post.
    Yours Truely, Left Wing Christian
    war_on_scam

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