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  1. #1
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    Nov 2005
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    Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    I'm starting to wonder if this stuff isn't a scam by itself.

    (Note that I'm not trying to start a fight here -- I'm questioning my beliefs and those of others.)(Also note that I'm one of those people that refrains from calling themselves Wiccan because I don't follow the Rede.)

    I mean, you have people that complain that Silver RavenWolf is a totally Fluffy Bunny and she lies in her books.

    Then there are the people who say Fiona Horne is a fake and a show-off, especially since she was on Mad, Mad House.

    And then -- most recently -- I find that Skye Alexander has reduced herself to scamming people into her astrological reports through snail-mail.

    ~)~

    But there's also a little voice protesting in my head, "It's not Witchcraft that is fake...It's Wicca!"

    When you think about it, Gerald Gardner founded Wicca (or the movement as we know it) on lies, plagarism and sexual fantasies (at least that's what I've heard) and Alex Sanders founded his Tradition using material he took from Gardner.

    ~)~

    Maybe Wicca, Witchcraft and related faiths are all fake.

    Maybe none of it is fake.

    Maybe only some of it is fake.

    Maybe it's just the magick part that's fake.


    Opinions, please?

  2. #2
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    Dec 2004
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    464

    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Read Doreen Valiente, she had a more cogent view, as well as more of the real credit for getting neo-paganism started. And she was most certainly not a fluffy bunny.

    I'm not a witch, mind, but Doreen is one of my heroes--very outspoken about what she believed, and most of that involved people being able to do things like marry who they please and worship how they please provided they weren't hurting people--it was Doreeen going to the House of Commons and talking to several MPs that kept witchcraft from being banned again, and she did a fair bit of work for immigrant rights and against stereotyping people by race or nationality. Doreen was very much into actually doing something about human rights, though she did it without a lot of fuss.

    Doreen said that her split with Gerald mostly came from his creating 'wicca' (things like inviting the press, stirring up sensationalism, etc), and she was trying to help recreate witchcraft, which is not a tabloid enterprise.

    These days you've got both and a whole lot of other offshoots. Is it a scam? If it's stuff like 'pay $1500 for a week-end workshop and we'll make you a shaman', yeah, probably. Other than that, it's just another (or a few other) religious/belief systems.
    Last edited by ComplexKid; 12-15-2005 at 01:16 PM.

  3. #3
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    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Ah, well...See there? I've never read Doreen's work. I bet that'll change a lot.

    Thanks!

  4. #4
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    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    I've said this so many times and with all my heart I mean it more each time -
    [B]If you're living like there ain't no God - you'd better be right! ! ![/B]

    So, I guess I'd rather believe because I can name miracles in my life that no man could have made happen, no other made-up mythical god could have brought about - only God could have healed and made me whole again!

  5. #5
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    464

    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    None of the witches I know would disagree with you on the point of G-d being the one that heals.

    There are many different belief systems. The Kotzker Rebbe said even atheism is holy, because then you believe it's all down to us to straighten out this sad sorry mess the world has become. And that's the trick of it, isn't it? Without G-d, it would all wink out of existence. But G-d doesn't force; we're the ones who have to choose to make the world better. (My unverifiable belief system coming into play there.)

  6. #6
    Join Date
    Sep 2004
    Posts
    27,196

    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    not to freakout here,.....but the goldenchild was a powerful movie about truth concerning the relationship of truth to evil in this world.the truth is always under attack by the satan or evil and the prize is the golden child potential in all men!the true meaning of evolution for man!or re-formation for man.and the key is no man left behind!an all enclusive outreach!and now is the time!for the world is awake to the idiocy of traditional retoric based on fear!for love is the key to it all and love is the way to the future if there is one!join or be left behind!!hehe!!

  7. #7
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    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Lexx,

    Good post there. I agree with you on the hypocrasy of the fear doctrine as I like to call it. I.E. do this or go to hell, don't do this and you'll go to heaven. Yes, love is the answer in my opinion.

  8. #8
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    Nov 2005
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    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Heh.

    I didn't even know there was a such movie.

    I just picked this screenname out a while ago for some site and never used it...

  9. #9

    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldenChild
    I'm starting to wonder if this stuff isn't a scam by itself.

    (Note that I'm not trying to start a fight here -- I'm questioning my beliefs and those of others.)(Also note that I'm one of those people that refrains from calling themselves Wiccan because I don't follow the Rede.)

    I mean, you have people that complain that Silver RavenWolf is a totally Fluffy Bunny and she lies in her books.

    Then there are the people who say Fiona Horne is a fake and a show-off, especially since she was on Mad, Mad House.

    And then -- most recently -- I find that Skye Alexander has reduced herself to scamming people into her astrological reports through snail-mail.

    ~)~

    But there's also a little voice protesting in my head, "It's not Witchcraft that is fake...It's Wicca!"

    When you think about it, Gerald Gardner founded Wicca (or the movement as we know it) on lies, plagarism and sexual fantasies (at least that's what I've heard) and Alex Sanders founded his Tradition using material he took from Gardner.

    ~)~

    Maybe Wicca, Witchcraft and related faiths are all fake.

    Maybe none of it is fake.

    Maybe only some of it is fake.

    Maybe it's just the magick part that's fake.


    Opinions, please?
    As with any other religion, there is controversy as to who is right and who is wrong. This is easily seen within Christianity and the several denominations that exsist within it.

    Everybody has their own opinion. and what works for one doesn't nessecarily work for another. Especially in Wicca and other earth based religions you have to find your own path. It helps to have a teacher, but ultimately your path is up to you.

    My advice to you is, instead of going by the words of others. Do some of your own reading and experimenting and find out for yourself. Don't go on hearsay. If you want to know about Gerald Gardner then read about him, read his books.
    Do your own research and come to your own conclusions.

  10. #10
    Join Date
    Jan 2006
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    6

    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by GoldenChild
    Heh.

    I didn't even know there was a such movie.

    I just picked this screenname out a while ago for some site and never used it...

    You've never heard of the movie the GoldenChild. it's an old Eddie Murphy movie!!!

  11. #11
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    Aug 2005
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    554

    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by ComplexKid
    None of the witches I know would disagree with you on the point of G-d being the one that heals.

    There are many different belief systems. The Kotzker Rebbe said even atheism is holy, because then you believe it's all down to us to straighten out this sad sorry mess the world has become. And that's the trick of it, isn't it? Without G-d, it would all wink out of existence. But G-d doesn't force; we're the ones who have to choose to make the world better. (My unverifiable belief system coming into play there.)

    Hi Complex,

    This is probably common knowledge to everyone but me, sorry. Why do you always type G-d instead of God?

    Just wondering

  12. #12
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    Dec 2004
    Posts
    464

    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Old Jewish customs die hard. You don't write out the name of the Most High because it might get desecrated if you do--ferinstance, someone could print out the page and line the birdcage with it. Unlikely, I grant, but it's always been the tradition to err on the side of caution. When old bibles, prayer books, etc., can't be used anymore, we bury them.

    Technically it doesn't usually apply these days, but I deal with a lot of older Jewish scholars, and out of respect for them, as well as for the tradition, I type it that way too.

  13. #13
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    Aug 2005
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    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by ComplexKid
    Old Jewish customs die hard. You don't write out the name of the Most High because it might get desecrated if you do--ferinstance, someone could print out the page and line the birdcage with it. Unlikely, I grant, but it's always been the tradition to err on the side of caution. When old bibles, prayer books, etc., can't be used anymore, we bury them.

    Technically it doesn't usually apply these days, but I deal with a lot of older Jewish scholars, and out of respect for them, as well as for the tradition, I type it that way too.

    Makes sense, thanks for your reply.

  14. #14
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    Nov 2005
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    16

    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Quote Originally Posted by Rissy
    You've never heard of the movie the Golden Child. it's an old Eddie Murphy movie!!!
    No, seriously, I haven't!

    lol

    But I can see that IMDb is going to have to be my next stop!


    --------------------

    (A few minutes later...)

    Oh, no wonder...It came out the year I was born!
    Last edited by GoldenChild; 01-16-2006 at 06:40 PM.

  15. #15
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    Harlem Represents!
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    235

    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    Ya'll going to hell. wicca is the devil

    Please help our church -
    Your donations no matter how small are appreciated :)

  16. #16
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    Chula Vista
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    Re: Wicca, Witchcraft, Etc.

    This stuff is a joke that died out in the 1980s

    or did it...................................?

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