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  1. #625
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    are there REALLY that many PRO MARXIST REVOLUTIONARYS in the educational system!? funny i never hear anybody discussing the PLAN!? it's healthy to consider and discus ALL forms of ADMINISTRATION when it comes to human social PRACTICES!! you know, use the BEST ideas from ALL sources to achieve the greatest good for the MOST!!
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  2. #626
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx View Post
    are there REALLY that many PRO MARXIST REVOLUTIONARYS in the educational system!? funny i never hear anybody discussing the PLAN!? it's healthy to consider and discus ALL forms of ADMINISTRATION when it comes to human social PRACTICES!! you know, use the BEST ideas from ALL sources to achieve the greatest good for the MOST!!
    Why don't you read some college textbooks and find out? Look up the definition of Marxism and then read social science books. Oh, can you read college level books?
    Last edited by Cnance; 03-21-2019 at 12:18 PM.

  3. #627
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Yes I have parused a few college texts. Although it was quite a while ago. I found them to be much purer than the society I was aware of!!
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  4. #628
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx View Post
    Yes I have parused a few college texts. Although it was quite a while ago. I found them to be much purer than the society I was aware of!!
    Well, if it is really true, what is you comment or criticism of this thread about communism? I won't accept nonsense for an answer!

  5. #629
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    I didn't read anything with credited communist ideology. My problem with your added ideas is they are false. You are politicAlly motivated to lie!!
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  6. #630
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx View Post
    I didn't read anything with credited communist ideology. My problem with your added ideas is they are false. You are politicAlly motivated to lie!!
    Knowing you are a communist, or Marxist, or pretend to be, I understand your hostility. However, since you are mostly ignorant about communism, I ignore your ideas! If you know what you say, post criticisms of my ideas about Marx. You know what, you are full of BS! You just make it up!
    Last edited by Cnance; 03-21-2019 at 04:06 PM.

  7. #631
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    In his later writings when he detailed worker exploitation in English factories, Marx blamed capitalists for the plight of workers. Even today, based on Marx's strong beliefs, he would find capitalist exploitation in industrial plants. Marx found exploitation wherever there were factory workers, and even in farm communities where farm hands toiled in fields of large land owners.

    Marx’s most egregious error was assuming a one class Communist society as the final resolution of capitalist exploitation. It would happen as a result of exploitation of the “proletariat,” or working classes. In the real world, we don’t find people amenable to the elimination of social differences. It is human nature to seek social recognition for competent outcomes. As an example, new employees seek jobs where they can excel or succeed. An efficient factory is one in which workers have found jobs to accomplish work tasks necessary to produce a product, not necessarily to just work or consume time on the clock. Therefore, social stratification based on job duties is essential for efficient productivity. There cannot be a classless society when most people seek recognition for individual areas of competence, not for the commands of superiors in the workplace, or dictates of government leaders or persons in authority. It is true that workers seek approval and recognition from superiors, but the end goal for both workers and supervisors is to produce products or services, not to persevere in the pursuit of sameness.

    In short, Marx assumed exploitation of workers when, in fact, workers use their abilities to accomplish work related tasks for wages or income. In the context of worker’s situation in the workplace, or in the community, Marx assumed workers, or the “proletariat,” would be exploited. However, in most cases, they go about doing their business to fulfill their needs in order to be useful or productive workers. In other words, Marx made unproven assumptions about workers or the proletariat class. Marx didn't prove his case of capitalist exploitation of workers. Moreover, Marx's assumption of workers being alienated because they were not fulfilling themselves in their work has not been proven.

    Marx's solution for worker exploitation is emancipation leading to “Communism,” which would give people the freedom that bourgeois society denied them. Communism is, he explains,"the positive transcendence of private property, or human self-estrangement, and therefore the real appropriation of the human essence by and for man... the complete return of man to himself as a social being..." (Economic and Philosophical Manuscripts of 1844). Marx was a very busy protagonist, he wrote volumes proposing a utopian ideology which continues to inspire, or as I have suggested, mislead liberals, in views of society.


    Not much has changed since Marx's time, there are still liberals on college campuses looking for a good cause, one to justify their anger and frustration for inequalities of society. Regardless, what has not changed is the natural process of social stratification whereby people become differentiated based on different competences. These differences are manifested in variety of different areas such as educational achievement, professional areas of certification, work or professional experience, and, ultimately, achievement in one's chosen profession or advocation. Thus, in advanced industrial societies we have social class differences based on different competency outcomes, which is directly related to the opportunity structure for occupational and professional achievements.

    Rather than accepting the common order of society based on natural processes, far left liberals, or radicals, find injustices everywhere. The problem with their rage is it is unwarranted. It is not the fault of powerful corporations or leaders, it is the direct consequence of natural processes. For advanced industrial societies to function, human resources must be allocated based on the best fit, or placement of individuals based on competences, skills, education, work experiences, and, of course, opportunities. Any other means for allocation of human resources would most likely result in inefficiencies, or the breakdown of the industrial system.
    Last edited by Cnance; 03-21-2019 at 05:59 PM.

  8. #632
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    stll LYING and EXAGGERATING as IF your SOME kind of EXPERT!! but i guess it's to BE EXPECTED all, 1 has to do is read your POSTS in the RELIGIOUS section!? but i will ADMIT cutting WAY back on INDUSTRIALIZATION would be VERY good for the ENVIRONMENT!!
    Last edited by lexx; 03-21-2019 at 09:21 PM.
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  9. #633
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx View Post
    stll LYING and EXAGGERATING as IF your SOME kind of EXPERT!! but i guess it's to BE EXPECTED all, 1 has to do is read your POSTS in the RELIGIOUS section!? but i will ADMIT cutting WAY back on INDUSTRIALIZATION would be VERY good for the ENVIRONMENT!!
    Instead of insults, how about some intelligent criticisms? As for lying, how would you know? You have no knowledge about the topic. All you do post insults and stupid comments,

  10. #634
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    ok there are so MANY but here is 1 i just grabbed......... human resources must be allocated based on the best fit, or placement of individuals based on competences, skills, education, work experiences, and, of course, opportunities. Any other means for allocation of human resources would most likely result in inefficiencies................. your implying marx is against your best fit theory of organization for efficiency!? that people would be forced to do work they do not want or do not excel at!?
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  11. #635
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx View Post
    ok there are so MANY but here is 1 i just grabbed......... human resources must be allocated based on the best fit, or placement of individuals based on competences, skills, education, work experiences, and, of course, opportunities. Any other means for allocation of human resources would most likely result in inefficiencies................. your implying marx is against your best fit theory of organization for efficiency!? that people would be forced to do work they do not want or do not excel at!?
    Wow, you came up with a criticism. However, it falls short. Although Marx was aware of the importance of worker ability, he was overly possessed with "exploitation of labor" (Proletariat). Marx was also obsessed with Hegel's dialectic for analyzing class conflict. Marx proposed, in the evolution of class conflict whereby a social class is reconstituted by replacing the preceding one, there would be a final resolution. The proletariat would rise up and overthrow their oppressors (capitalists). The final resolution of class conflict would be a communist, or equalitarian society. Here is where Marx's prediction of a new social class emerging into equalitarianism falls apart. If, as Marx assumed, workers contribute "each according to ability, and each according to need," there would be, by natural law, social differences. As expected, in a communist society, capitalist practices are utilized. Since it is impossible to produce a "communist society," a fake one based on communist ideology is the only possibility. Subsequently, we have a long history of failed communist nations because they can't bring about Marx's communism.

    What happens to workers, each with different abilities? Does Communist China have the answer for Marx's contradictions? How do you fulfill Marx's dream of equalitarianism in an industrial world? Well, China claims to have done it, although with big contradictions, by using capitalism to finance communism. It is total hypocrisy! Chinese communist officials declare the purity of communism all the while practicing capitalism to finance it. Yes, they have found the "perfect solution." However, Marx is rolling over in his grave knowing the Chinese communist party is not pure, or in keeping with the "holy grail of communism." Ha ha.
    Last edited by Cnance; 03-22-2019 at 06:23 PM.

  12. #636
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    so you believe that EXPLOITATION in capitalism does NOT exist!? or if it does it is becuz people ACCEPT it as NORMAL or they just dont know how to OPPOSE it or just dont ORGANIZE!? your EQUALITARIANISM could mean just the REALIZATION of SELF WORTH!?
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  13. #637
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx View Post
    so you believe that EXPLOITATION in capitalism does NOT exist!? or if it does it is becuz people ACCEPT it as NORMAL or they just dont know how to OPPOSE it or just dont ORGANIZE!? your EQUALITARIANISM could mean just the REALIZATION of SELF WORTH!?
    The topic is communism. I never said capitalism is perfect. Anything man made is imperfect. However, as I have indicated, capitalism is better than communism. Freedom exists in capitalist nations, whereas, in communist nations, the government controls almost every aspect of citizenship, while granting people little, if any, freedom. So, lexx should go a and live in Communist China and then report how much better it is there than in the US. ha. ha.

  14. #638
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Utopian thought shuttles between detailed programs of transition and the blank principle of absolute difference. Communism, as Marx and Engels wrote in The German Ideology, is “not an ideal to which reality will have to adjust itself. We call communism the real movement which abolishes the present state of things.” But communism lacked much intellectual content or political allure if it was merely a fated, and otherwise faceless, destination. Marx’s positive notion of communism, vague enough but not empty, included such features as an economy run by “the associated producers”, public self-administration along the lines suggested by the Paris Commune, and even something like what today is called environmental sustainability.

    More from the strength of the movements invoking it than from the clarity of the idea, communism probably claimed its greatest number of adherents sometime in the 1970s. By the end of the twentieth century, it had forfeited its good name through the ineffectiveness of communist parties in Western Europe and the economic incompetence and political crimes of one-party state dictatorships elsewhere.
    The practical failures exposed the shortcomings of theory. Did the “planned application” of the means of production “to priorities determined democratically by the mass of workers” or “the demise of commodity production and money relations”—to quote the revolutionary summons concluding Ernest Mandel’s Late Capitalism (1975 )—mean anything both conceivable and desirable? Visions of market socialism from the 1980s and early 1990s came too late to prevent the public from identifying capitalism with the virtues of markets, as real as they are limited, and socialism with the defects of central planning.

    https://www.theeuropean-magazine.com...mmunist-utopia

  15. #639
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Karl Marx called it dialectic materialism, ongoing class conflict resulting in the destruction of the capitalist class in favor of the proletariat. In the process of destroying social classes in favor of one social class (Communism), capitalists are to be eliminated. It is not a natural process, strong government control is necessary to produce such and unnatural society, one in which individual freedom is reduced. Stalin favored extermination of the bourgeois class of "capitalist upstarts" in order to make a new social order, or communism. He exterminated several million Russians to bring about the new communist order, which, of course, never happened. You can’t change human nature! Cuba is undergoing devastating damage from the many decades of communism. The communist assumption of equality defies human nature. Sorry, Marx did not get it right. If he had, we would have worldwide communism. He assumed an equalitarian society of one social class would fulfill peoples' needs. In reality, a one-party society violates individual freedom to pursue one’s own destiny based on what is best for each individual. Moreover, we don't find individuals resembling one another. People tend to compete in areas where they can maximize competencies. Subsequent, people mobilize resources, the net results of which is change, not a stagnant one class society.

  16. #640
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    One of Marx's most important ideas about capitalism is it causes debilitating alienation.

    Alienation[edit]
    For the main article on this topic, see Marx'stheory of alienation
    Alienation, for Marx, is the estrangement of humans from aspectsof their human nature. Since - as we have seen - human nature consists in aparticular set of vital drives and tendencies, whose exercise constitutesflourishing, alienation is a condition wherein these drives and tendencies arestunted. For essential powers, alienation substitutes disempowerment; formaking one's own life one's object, one's life becoming an object of capital. Marxbelieves that alienation will be a feature of all society before communism. Theopposite of, alienation is 'actualization' or 'self-activity' - the activity ofthe self, controlled by and for the self.[citation needed]

    Marx's solution, the route to human emancipation, wasCommunism, which would give people the freedom that bourgeois society deniesthem. Communism is, he explains, "the positive transcendence of privateproperty, or human self-estrangement, and therefore the real appropriationof the human essence by and for man... the complete return of man tohimself as a social being..." (Economic and PhilosophicalManuscripts of 1844)

    Breaking down his argument, one must question Marx's definition of alienation insofar as it relates to work. For Marx, alienation is when a person is uninvolved in work so as to feel like an object, or with little emotional attachment. The person performs work duties without "real involvement" for the job. As an example, on an assembly line, the person feels like an extension of the machinery.Marx proposes alienation causes workers to seek freedom from the repressive circumstances of work therefore producing conditions for revolution. However, Marx's ideas for workers becoming emancipated from "alienating work" is wrong, it is a total exaggeration of the circumstances of work. In the real world, workers in automated plants are involved in their work to the extinct to which they consciously seek work routines leading to worker satisfaction and fulfillment for doing a "good job." In order to accomplish the task, the worker must "consciously" become involved so as to utilize resources to complete the job, which is no alienation. Marx spent too much time making up situations to fit his bias against capitalism and wrote books to support those biases. Marx never worked in those plants. He assumed without knowing. In short, personal experiences are necessary in order to understand situations.

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