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  1. #641
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Empirical research is a heavy handed tool, it brings down false ideas, or false ideologies. In the course of empirical studies, we find nothing convincing about Marx's ridiculous ideas. Radical Communists just accept their version of reality to be correct. Where is the evidence for social equality? Where is the evidence for worker alienation? Where is the evidence for social stratification being an unnatural condition for human societies? WHERE IS THE EVIDENCE?

    Oh, I get it! Marxism is like an religion. Taking the perspective of those at the bottom end of the social class ladder, there are issues of social injustices. In capitalist nations like the US, common law addresses such matters, or to a degree. There are issues of social inequality which cannot, or have not, been addressed in capitalist societies, but, perhaps, there is no resolution. Unfortunately, incompetence is an "unfortunate state" for which there may be no resolution. It is reality! Oh, oh, I am in big trouble. The Marxist police will be at my throat.

    Isn't it interesting, most of Marx's theory has not been tested. It has been assumed to be correct, because, after all, there should be no social injustice, or no inequality. So much for fairly land and Marxism. Oh, that's it, Marxism is a dream land theory. Oh, I hear it now, stop that criticism, it is upsetting Marxists.

    My favorite criticism of Marxism is about social stratification whereby Marx claimed it to be "unnatural," or inappropriate. So, we go back in history and search for equality. We look at early settlements throughout the world. Remember, Marx suggested we go back to early civilizations. There we would find people living in harmony, or in peace loving tribal communities. Is that really true? The answer, of course, is NO! There is no evidence for such communities!


    However, one might say, we should not dismiss Marx, he was brilliant, and he wrote so much about problems of capitalism. Well, if social problems is the issue, there is material in "every society." However, where do we find equality? Keep looking, it may be under a rock someplace! ha. ha.
    Last edited by Cnance; 03-27-2019 at 03:19 PM.

  2. #642
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    It is happening, and it may be the end for capitalism, at least in higher education. As for the average American with common sense, there is hope. It seems the average American may be smarter than the average social science professor. If you have common sense and a lot of work experience, don't go to college. Really? Yes, in college, you may be brain washed with Marxism. You will come back into the world with a new perspective, one to ensure you'll rebel against democracy as protected by the US Constitution. You'll hold a lot of stupid ideas about overturning capitalism in favor of a "loving socialist order." Then, if you go along with the right leaders, you can become part of a new communist society. College professors will celebrate until they loose their jobs and pensions because the new social order won't support them, and, after all, we have no need for study routines which support the democratic way of life in a capitalist society. Yes, who needs a career or a job when everyone shares in common in a new Communist society. Oh yes, sociology professors will be overwhelmed with happiness knowing their Marxist teachings may taken hold to produce a wonderful world of "sameness."


    https://www.econlib.org/archives/201...valence_1.html

    https://dailycaller.com/2016/01/11/m...tern-academia/
    Last edited by Cnance; 04-04-2019 at 01:53 PM.

  3. #643
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    How about "communes?" Aren't they a form of communism? I propose they fail for the same reasons "communist governments" fail. They propose equality, when, in fact, it really doesn't exist, They propose sharing everything in common, when, in fact, people are rewarded according to competency based contributions. Mostly, they fail from "failed assumptions!" Communes utilize utopian ideas in order to make a community. When those ideas fail, communes collapse.

    The central characteristics of communes, or core principles thatdefine communes, have been expressed in various forms over the years. Before 1840 such communities were known as "communist and socialist settlements"; by 1860, they were also called "communitarian"and by around 1920 the term "intentional community"
    [citationneeded] had been added to the vernacular of some theorists. The term "communitarian" was invented by the Suffolk-born radical John Goodwyn Barmby, subsequently a Unitarianminister.[4]
    At the start of the 1970s, TheNew Communes author Ron E. Roberts classified communes as a subclass of a larger category of Utopias.[5] He listed three main characteristics. Communes of this period tended to develop their own characteristics of theory though, so while many strived for variously expressed forms of egalitarianism, Roberts' list should never beread as typical. Roberts' three listed items were: first, egalitarianism – that communes specifically rejected hierarchy or graduations of social status as being necessary to social order. Second, human scale – that members of some communes saw the scale of society as it was then organized as being too industrialized(or factory sized) and therefore unsympathetic to human dimensions. And third, that communes were consciously anti-bureaucratic.[5]
    Twenty five years later, Dr. Bill Metcalf, in his edited book Shared Visions, Shared Lives defined communes as having the following core principles: the importance of the group as opposed to the nuclear family unit, a "common purse", a collective household, group decision making in general and intimate affairs.[6] Sharing everyday life and facilities, a commune is an idealized form of family, being a new sort of "primary group" (generally with fewer than 20 people although again there are outstanding examples of much larger communes or communes that experienced episodes with much larger populations). Commune members have emotional bonds to the whole group rather than to any sub-group, and the commune is experienced with emotions which go beyond just social collectivity.[6]

    https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Commune
    Last edited by Cnance; 04-06-2019 at 04:12 PM.

  4. #644
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Throughout the world, there have been numerous commune experiments. Apparently, they have short lifespans because they cannot form into mini societies, or worlds where everyday competency needs are fulfilled. Moreover, issues of equality become problematic whereby commune rules bend everyday norms into untenable means for interacting. However, there have been some successes, usually under circumstances of strong leadership and dedicated membership with unambiguous rules and procedures. However, these communes are short in duration insofar as they are subject to fouled up interactions from unmet equalitarian agendas.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/goingoutguide/movies/the-commune-a-tale-of-idealism-and-failure-in-1970s-group-living/2017/05/25/8461aa56-3bf9-11e7-9e48-c4f199710b69_story.html?noredirect=on&utm_term=.9d3bd462bdf3

    https://www.nytimes.com/1998/08/03/u...-movement.html

    http://mentalfloss.com/article/23297...-didnt-pan-out

    https://www.rollingstone.com/culture...gerous-106818/
    Last edited by Cnance; 04-08-2019 at 08:07 PM.

  5. #645
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Marx’s definition of human nature is problematic whereby, instead of acknowledging human tendencies toward fulfilling competency needs, he envisioned humans in a communist world away from “the crippling influence of specialization." For Marx, capitalism is the culprit for workers insofar as they become alienated in their jobs. Instead of acknowledge possibilities for workers to adopt to specialized jobs and therefore utilize areas of competency, Marx proposes a definition of human nature which is antithetical to human tendencies to satisfy needs for successful completion of jobs. In most work situations, supervisors, or managers, are adept at allocating jobs based on worker ability and experience. Therefore, in order to produce a product, there must be coordination between managers and workers. Otherwise, we have situations of inefficacy or unproductive work efforts.

    Marx’s idea for the fulfillment of human tendencies is unrealistic because he assumed an incorrect model for human nature. Marx proposed an utopian ideal world (Communism) where “society regulates the general production and thus makes it possible for me to do one thing today and another tomorrow, to hunt in the morning, fish in the afternoon, rear cattle in the evening, criticize after dinner, just as I have a mind, without ever becoming hunter, fisherman, shepherd or critic." Evidently, Marx didn’t consult with workers or managers in order to have a good understanding of work situations. He assumed, without really knowing, as a consequence of a strong ideological bias for capitalism being a "dehumanizing world," rather than a world for fulfilling competency needs. In other words, if you have strong beliefs, or prejudices, the possibility for you confirming them is greater than if you have an open mind for finding “objective truths.”

    My criticism of Marx is not intended to diminish the harmful consequences of capitalism during the time of Marx. I acknowledge exploitation of workers, then and now. However, one must acknowledge advances in labor relations as a consequence of labor movements and government regulations. It is also important to point out the degree to which “interpretation” plays a role in analyzing labor and industrial relations. If one assumes work to be alienating, and capitalism to be antithetical to human nature, then one will find most activities associated with modern society to be harmful.

    Are there happy workers? In the work world, we find a variety of different temperaments. We find people happily engaged in challenging tasks, and there are workers with strong work ethics who find fulfillment in work. My primary point is Marx didn't acknowledge the other side of the picture having to do with "fulfillment of competence needs." People seek recognition for fulfillment of tasks or activities for which they derive satisfaction. Without opportunities to fulfill competence needs, humans drift into apathetic situations, or areas of unfulfillment leading to low self-esteem. The more freedom people have in capitalist societies, the more they find opportunities to fulfill competency needs. Evidence for the work commitment to capitalism is overwhelming, it is found in low unemployment, high enrollment in tech training programs, high levels of worker satisfaction, manufacturing productivity, and a booming US economy. Contrary to Marx's statement about specialization being alienating, it has allowed workers to development and utilize training programs in order to maximize areas of competency. For individuals to maintain a healthy psychic, or to maintain self-esteem, they must utilize their talents, skills, or "areas of competency." In modern societies, jobs provide excellent opportunities for people to utilize abilities, which is a key factor for "survival" as well as "self-expression."
    Last edited by Cnance; 04-12-2019 at 11:40 PM.

  6. #646
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Read these articles about terrorism & politics in India! Links:- 1. https://www.thebloggerspoint.in/2019...top-on_10.html
    2. https://www.thebloggerspoint.in/2019...terrorism.html

  7. #647
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Quote Originally Posted by Atuls93 View Post
    Read these articles about terrorism & politics in India! Links:- 1. https://www.thebloggerspoint.in/2019...top-on_10.html
    2. https://www.thebloggerspoint.in/2019...terrorism.html
    I acknowledge the terrorist problem in India. How is it related to communism? Perhaps, you are making a reference to China as a communist nation.

  8. #648
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    When Trump became president the US was saved from becoming a Clinton welfare state following Obama's socialist (Marxist) agenda. Finally, the American people woke up to Democratic abuses, a nightmare of tax and spend which has nearly bankrupt the nation. Trump has enacted common sense solutions to a failing economy. Now corporations don't have to go abroad to avoid huge taxes, they can prosper in a capitalist nation where prospering from honest labor is not a shameful practice. What a relief, the US does not have to suffer from Obama's elitism.

  9. #649
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Reducing social differences is a difficult, if not impossible, task. If ever accomplished, it would inhibit individual freedom. No matter what government leaders do, or attempt to do, to bring about an equalitarian society, the results are often disastrous. Stringent government rules and regulations are required for a "state of equality." This heavy-handed government causes the Proletariat (workers) to revolt from government repression? Communism limits freedom, stifles opportunities, and, in almost every way, curtails opportunities for individual development.

    Karl Marx called it dialectic materialism, ongoing class conflict resulting in the destruction of the capitalist class in favor of the proletariat. In the process of destroying social classes in favor of one social class (Communism), capitalists are to be eliminated. It is not a natural process, strong government control is necessary to produce such and unnatural society, one in which individual freedom is reduced. Stalin favored extermination of the bourgeois class of "capitalist upstarts" in order to make a new social order, or communism. He exterminated several million Russians to bring about the new communist order, which, of course, never happened. You canít change human nature! Cuba is undergoing devastating damage from the many decades of communism. The communist assumption of equality defies human nature. Sorry, Marx did not get it right. If he had, we would have worldwide communism. He assumed an equalitarian society of one social class would fulfill peoples' needs. In reality, a one-party society violates individual freedom to pursue oneís own destiny based on what is best for each individual. Moreover, we don't find individuals resembling one another. People tend to compete in areas where they can maximize competencies. Subsequent, people mobilize resources, the net results of which is change, not a stagnant one class society.

  10. #650
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    Historical Records are very revealing as to the horrible consequences of communism. Around the world, communism has failed with horrific loss of human life.

    Two major factors were the most important causes of the atrocities inflicted by communist regimes: perverse incentives and inadequate knowledge. The establishment of the centrally planned economy and society required by socialist ideology necessitated an enormous concentration of power. While communists looked forward to a utopian society in which the state could eventually “wither away,” they believed they first had to establish a state-run economy in order to manage production in the interests of the people. In that respect, they had much in common with other socialists.



    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2017/11/07/lessons-from-a-century-of-communism/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.7c4b1f42e578
    Last edited by Cnance; 04-14-2019 at 06:30 PM.

  11. #651
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    Re: Is Communism the best fit for society?

    As history has shown, democracy cannot function in a communist society, which may be an important reason for it's failure. The most important reason, however, is the obsession of socialist or communist leaders to control government in order to being about an equalitarian society. Where is the real world do we find equality, or similarities?

    Unfortunately, it is unlikely that a communist state could remain democratic for long, even if it started out that way. Democracy requires effective opposition parties. And in order to function, such parties need to be able to put out their message and mobilize voters, which in turn requires extensive resources. In an economic system in which all or nearly all valuable resources are controlled by the state, the incumbent government can easily strangle opposition by denying them access to those resources. Under socialism, the opposition cannot function if they are not allowed to spread their message on state-owned media, or use state-owned property for their rallies and meetings. It is no accident that virtually every communist regime suppressed opposition parties soon after coming to power.

    Even if a communist state could somehow remain democratic over the long run, it is hard to see how it could solve the twin problems of knowledge and incentives. Whether democratic or not, a socialist economy would still require enormous concentration of power, and extensive coercion. And democratic socialist planners would run into much the same information problems as their authoritarian counterparts. In addition, in a society where the government controls all or most of the economy, it would be virtually impossible for voters to acquire enough knowledge to monitor the state’s many activities. This would greatly exacerbate the already severe problem of voter ignorance that plagues modern democracy.

    https://www.washingtonpost.com/news/volokh-conspiracy/wp/2017/11/07/lessons-from-a-century-of-communism/?noredirect=on&utm_term=.980b3303f259
    Last edited by Cnance; 04-14-2019 at 11:24 PM.

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