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  1. #1
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    Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    The Arabic text of the recently released letter alleged to be by Zawahiri (al-Qaeda's number two man) to Abu Musab al-Zarqawi in Iraq raises questions for me as to its authenticity.

    The very first element of the letter is the blessing on the Prophet. It says:

    al-salah wa al-salam `ala rasuli'llahi wa a-lihi wa suhubihi . . .

    (peace and blessings be upon the Messenger of God and his family and his companions . . .)

    the phrase "salla Allahu `alayhi wa alihi wa sallam" (the blessings and peace of God be upon him and his family) is a Shiite form of the salutation, because of the emphasis of the Shiites on the House or descendants of the Prophet. Because of the cultural influence of Shiism in South Asia, one does find that form of the salutation in Pakistan and India among Sunni Muslims.

    I have never, ever heard a Sunni Muslim add "wa alihi" (and his family) to the salutation. I associated it strongly with Iran and Shiism, and was taken aback to hear Sunnis say it on Pakistani television. Certainly, I never heard that form of it all the time I lived in Egypt.

    I just put "salla Allahu `alayhi wa alihi wa sallam" into google in English transliteration and *all* the sites that came up on the first page were either Shiite or Pakistani Sunni (Chishti, Barelvi, etc.) I tried adding Misr (Egypt) to the phrase and got a Shiite attack on the medieval Sunni hardline thinker, Ibn Taymiya. I tried adding Qaida and got a Shiite attack on Sunni extremism.

    I do not believe that an Egyptian like al-Zawahiri would use this phraseology at all. But he certainly would not use it to open a letter to a Salafi. Sunni hardliners deeply object to what they see as Shiite idolatry of the imams or descendants of the Prophet Muhammad, for whom they made shrines such as Ali's at Najaf and Husayn's at Karbala. In fact, hard line Wahhabis from Saudi Arabia attacked and sacked Karbala in 1803.

    Adding to the salutation "the peace and blessings of God be upon him [Muhammad]" the phrase "and his family" would be an insult to Zarqawi and to the hardline Sunnis in Iraq.

    Later he refers to Husain, the grandson of the Prophet Muhammad, as al-Imam al-sibt, "the Imam, the grandson". I do not believe that a hard line Sunni such as Zawahiri would call Husain an Imam. That is Shiite terminology.

    The letter then says how much Zawahiri misses meeting with Zarqawi. Zarqawi was not part of al-Qaeda when he was in Afghanistan. He had a rivalry with it. And when he went back to Jordan he did not allow the Jordanian and German chapters of his Tawhid wa Jihad group to send money to Bin Laden. If Zawahiri was going to bring up old times, he would have had to find a way to get past this troubled history, not just pretend that the two used to pal around.

    My gut tells me that the letter is a forgery. Most likely it is a black psy-ops operation of the US. But it could also come from Iran, since the mistakes are those a Shiite might make when pretending to be a Sunni. Or it could come from an Iraqi Shiite group attempting to manipulate the United States. Hmmm.

    The authenticity has even been questioned by Al-Qaeda in Iraq.
    Last edited by ianmatthews; 10-14-2005 at 08:18 AM.

  2. #2
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    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    Quote Originally Posted by ianmatthews
    Well, as long as both Ian AND al-qaeda say it's a rathergate forgery, then I guess that it probably is.?.?.?.? :confused:



    No frickin' way Ian! It's going to take a lot more than your hunches and al-qaeda's denial to disprove authenticity.

  3. #3
    tommywho70x Guest

    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raider
    Well, as long as both Ian AND al-qaeda say it's a rathergate forgery, then I guess that it probably is.?.?.?.? :confused:



    No frickin' way Ian! It's going to take a lot more than your hunches and al-qaeda's denial to disprove authenticity.
    And it will take a lot more than an ad hominem backhand fallaciously demeaning Ian's scholarly research to prove authenticity, raider.

    show us your proof or put a sock in it, skull phvcker!

  4. #4
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    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    A little background on this turd - Zawahri.


    The Egyptian Islamic Jihad (EIJ), also called the Islamic Jihad and the Jihad Group, is an Egyptian Islamic group active since the late 1970s with origins in the Muslim Brotherhood. It suffered setbacks as a result of numerous arrests of operatives worldwide, most recently in Lebanon and Yemen. The organization's primary goals are to overthrow the Egyptian Government and replace it with an Islamic state and to attack United States and Israeli interests in Egypt and abroad.

    Activities
    The organization specializes in armed attacks against high-level Egyptian Government personnel, including cabinet ministers, and car-bombings against official US and Egyptian facilities. The original Jihad was responsible for the assassination in 1981 of Egyptian President Anwar Sadat. It also claimed responsibility for the attempted assassinations of Interior Minister Hassan al-Alfi in August 1993 and Prime Minister Atef Sedky in November 1993. Egyptian Jihad and rival armed group Gama'at Islamiya launched a wave of violence against Egypt's secular government in 1992, a campaign they only abandoned at the end of the decade. Nearly 1300 people died in the unrest, including policemen, and government officials, foreign tourists and Egyptian Christians. It is responsible for the Egyptian Embassy bombing in Islamabad, Pakistan in 1995; in 1998, a planned attack against the US Embassy in Albania was thwarted.

    Leadership
    Al-Sharif passed the Jihad leadership to Ayman al-Zawahri amid dissent within the movement in 1991. The al-Zawahri faction subsequently formed an alliance with Al-Qaeda leading over time to the effective merger of the two groups operations inside Afghanistan.

    Although al-Zawahri is frequently refered to as a 'lieutenant' or 'second in command' of Al Qaeda this description is misleading as it implies a hierarchical relationship. The modern Al Qaeda organization is the combination of Bin Laden's financial resources with al-Zawahri's ideological and operational leadership. Despite the effective merger of al-Zawahri and Bin Laden's groups in the Aghanistan area of operations there is evidence that suggests that at least part of the Islamic Jihad group continuing to operate in Egypt remains independent of Bin Laden's organization and reports for al-Zawahri personally.

    Location/Area of Operation
    The Egyptian Islamic Jihad operates in the Cairo area. It has a network outside Egypt, including Yemen, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Sudan,

    ************************************************** ********

    In 1998 he formally merged Egyptian Islamic Jihad into al-Qaeda. According to reports by a former al-Qaida member, he has worked in the al-Qaida organization since its inception and was a senior member of the group's shura council.

    As, a senior member of the shura, that may lead one to believe that Zawahiri is tolerant of different sects, as long as they're engaged fully in jihad. To smooth the lines of the differing sects, he includes common phrases in his writings. Of course, I may be wrong, but that is doubtful. :cool:

  5. #5
    tommywho70x Guest

    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    nice try, but that does nothing to refute the assertion that the letter is a forgery.

    all it does is show us that you know how to access information about enemies of the state of dubya dubya dubya firstgov.gov. AND FAIL to cite the source of your information as if 'a little background' on za-raghead-scumbag came off the top off your head.


    B.F.D. RELEVANCE SCORE == '0'


    prove the letter is not a forgery. ian has dissected the letter on the basis of his knowledge of the language usage differences between islamic sects.

    you are trying to refute his argument with demonstrations that the principles are scumbags and therefore they actually wrote the letter.


    that's illogical and does not compute.
    Last edited by tommywho70x; 10-14-2005 at 02:51 PM.

  6. #6
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    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    Quote Originally Posted by tommywho70x
    nice try, but that does nothing to refute the assertion that the letter is a forgery.

    all it does is show us that you know how to access information about enemies of the state of dubya dubya dubya firstgov.gov. AND FAIL to cite the source of your information as if 'a little background' on za-raghead-scumbag came off the top off your head.


    B.F.D. RELEVANCE SCORE == '0'


    prove the letter is not a forgery. ian has dissected the letter on the basis of his knowledge of the language usage differences between islamic sects.

    you are trying to refute his argument with demonstrations that the principles are scumbags and therefore they actually wrote the letter.


    that's illogical and does not compute.
    You're a real challenged one aren't you?

    As, a senior member of the shura, that may lead one to believe that Zawahiri is tolerant of different sects, as long as they're engaged fully in jihad. To smooth the lines of the differing sects, he includes common phrases in his writings. Of course, I may be wrong, but that is doubtful.

  7. #7
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    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    Hey Tom, try this link, it "appears" that Ian may be passing himself off as Cole. The "original" author has a mug shot on this link here - I could not tell from his skin color if he is a credible dialect/language expert on that reigion. He looks kinda white to me + he looks like a flaming lib!

    http://www.juancole.com/2005/10/zawa...wi-shiite.html


    He IS a LIB! Thank goodness I did your research for you. Be careful where you place your trust tommy. Google 'Juan Cole' and a pluthra of bushbash propaganda floods the screen. I WILL expect you to bash Ian for not citing copywrite.
    Last edited by Raider; 10-14-2005 at 03:21 PM.

  8. #8
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    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raider
    A little background on this turd - Zawahri.


    The Egyptian Islamic Jihad (EIJ), also called the Islamic Jihad and the Jihad Group, is an Egyptian Islamic group active since the late 1970s with origins in the Muslim Brotherhood. It suffered setbacks as a result of numerous arrests of operatives worldwide, most recently in Lebanon and Yemen. The organization's primary goals are to overthrow the Egyptian Government and replace it with an Islamic state and to attack United States and Israeli interests in Egypt and abroad.

    Activities
    The organization specializes in armed attacks against high-level Egyptian Government personnel, including cabinet ministers, and car-bombings against official US and Egyptian facilities. The original Jihad was responsible for the assassination in 1981 of Egyptian President Anwar Sadat. It also claimed responsibility for the attempted assassinations of Interior Minister Hassan al-Alfi in August 1993 and Prime Minister Atef Sedky in November 1993. Egyptian Jihad and rival armed group Gama'at Islamiya launched a wave of violence against Egypt's secular government in 1992, a campaign they only abandoned at the end of the decade. Nearly 1300 people died in the unrest, including policemen, and government officials, foreign tourists and Egyptian Christians. It is responsible for the Egyptian Embassy bombing in Islamabad, Pakistan in 1995; in 1998, a planned attack against the US Embassy in Albania was thwarted.

    Leadership
    Al-Sharif passed the Jihad leadership to Ayman al-Zawahri amid dissent within the movement in 1991. The al-Zawahri faction subsequently formed an alliance with Al-Qaeda leading over time to the effective merger of the two groups operations inside Afghanistan.

    Although al-Zawahri is frequently refered to as a 'lieutenant' or 'second in command' of Al Qaeda this description is misleading as it implies a hierarchical relationship. The modern Al Qaeda organization is the combination of Bin Laden's financial resources with al-Zawahri's ideological and operational leadership. Despite the effective merger of al-Zawahri and Bin Laden's groups in the Aghanistan area of operations there is evidence that suggests that at least part of the Islamic Jihad group continuing to operate in Egypt remains independent of Bin Laden's organization and reports for al-Zawahri personally.

    Location/Area of Operation
    The Egyptian Islamic Jihad operates in the Cairo area. It has a network outside Egypt, including Yemen, Afghanistan, Pakistan, Sudan,

    ************************************************** ********

    In 1998 he formally merged Egyptian Islamic Jihad into al-Qaeda. According to reports by a former al-Qaida member, he has worked in the al-Qaida organization since its inception and was a senior member of the group's shura council.

    As, a senior member of the shura, that may lead one to believe that Zawahiri is tolerant of different sects, as long as they're engaged fully in jihad. To smooth the lines of the differing sects, he includes common phrases in his writings. Of course, I may be wrong, but that is doubtful. :cool:
    info source= http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ayman_al-Zawahiri

  9. #9
    tommywho70x Guest

    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    lemme see if i can make any sense out of this latest blather blast. just keep in mind that you are dealing with a non-aligned anti-partisan politics individual who is convinced that the whole LIBS VS. CONS trip is some kind of American jihadist propaganda ploy.


    on second thought, there is nothing but nonsense here, screw you and quit wasting my time with crap, though I have to agree that unless Username: ianmatthews is an alias for Juan Cole, Professor of History, University of Michigan, we got us a clear case of copyright infringement by plagiarism with this thread.

    in either case, nothing you have posted to it refutes the argument itself

    unlike you, when i am posting on scam is when i'm working and have multiple browser windows open. some of them demand a lot more attention than reading and responding to your crappizational analysis of the world according to about*:*blank

  10. #10
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    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    Quote Originally Posted by tommywho70x
    in either case, nothing you have posted to it refutes the argument itself
    Ok, I'll repeat it for you once again.

    "As, a senior member of the shura, that may lead one to believe that Zawahiri is tolerant of different sects, as long as they're engaged fully in jihad. To smooth the lines of the differing sects, he includes common phrases in his writings. Of course, I may be wrong, but that is doubtful." (raider)

    This statement directly refutes the juan cole arguement. STICK THAT IN YOUR BONG AND CHOKE ON IT FOR A WHILE DIPSH!T :cool:

  11. #11
    tommywho70x Guest

    Re: Zawahiri Letter to Zarqawi: A Shiite Forgery?

    Quote Originally Posted by Raider
    Ok, I'll repeat it for you once again.

    "As, a senior member of the shura, that may lead one to believe that Zawahiri is tolerant of different sects, as long as they're engaged fully in jihad. To smooth the lines of the differing sects, he includes common phrases in his writings. Of course, I may be wrong, but that is doubtful." (raider)

    This statement directly refutes the juan cole arguement. STICK THAT IN YOUR BONG AND CHOKE ON IT FOR A WHILE DIPSH!T :cool:
    i don't like bongs, what does that have to do with whether the letter was a forgery or not and is ianmatthews juancole or a plagiarist? :rolleyes:

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