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Thread: hydrogen fuel

  1. #1
    Lord_jag's Avatar
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    hydrogen fuel

    Does anyone have any mechanical background? I have an idea and need to run it by you.

    I am creating my own hydrogen using solar panel produced electricity (just for fun). I want to put some of it in the car to boost fuel economy.

    The idea is that with extra combustable in the cylinder, the car should have more power with less gasoline, so the efficently should be up.

    Now this isn't one of those "run your car on water" scams. I will make the hydrogen at home, capture it, pressurize it and then put it in the engine. My question is where?

    I'm guessing that fuel goes in though the injector, and air comes in through the intake. Can I just tap a hole in the intake manifold and release some pressurized hydrogen in there? Could it be that simple?

    I'm worried that with a second fuel buring oxygen, that I would need to find another way to advance the car without adding fuel.

    I've seen on TV a standard car (with a carburator) running on hydrogen alone, so I know it can be done. I don't think my solar array will make enough hydrogen, so I want to be able to use what I produce and then go back to gas - on the fly and without noticing it.

    Like when I pull out on the highway I should be able to do 60 mph without pressing all that hard on the pedal. When the hydrogen runs out, my car will lose a little power and I'll have to give it more gas. That's what I really want.

    Would that work or do I need some kind of dynamic timing adjustment to pull this off?
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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    Disclaimer: Just basic knowledge. Thats all.

    Dude, unless you want to blow up you car, stop what you are doing. The only way to use hydrogen/oxygen cell in your vehicle is to mix hydrogen with oxygen in especially designed engine. You have no knowledge or mechanical expertise to build such engine.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    With the newer cars and trucks, the software that helps to run these engines will nullify any gain that is made by any means change in fuel whatever. The software will simply adjust and bring the engine within its programed specs. You will need new software, or design something from the ground up. In other words I don't think it would work very well in my opinion. It would be cool if it did.
    Last edited by howdy; 06-13-2008 at 04:54 PM.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    Like howdy said, I think you would need an older car (one that's not controlled with a chip) and you'd need to know a bit about adjusting the timing. I don't see why it couldn't work in theory, but a things you'd need to adjust the mixtures so that the hydrogen doesn't combust to early and lead to knocking, and so that the ratio of fuel/air/hydrogen is just right for everything to combust. Petrol has to be vaporised in a very specific concentration for it to burn, and I would imagine adding hydrogen to the mix is going to change that, plus the hydrogen probably needs it's own specific concentration as well.

    So in theory I guess I could work, but you'll need to be prepared to mess around with it a while.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    Just wondering. Wouldn't the roads stay fairly slick from all the steam exhaust if all cars were burning hydrogen?
    Looks like some hydrogen cars are up and running. Fuel cells seem the way to go. We need a dependable source of hydrogen, now. Perhaps nuclear power will do the trick for the conversion.
    Tons of pictures and knowledge resources here--
    http://www.hydrogencarsnow.com/honda-fcx-clarity.htm
    Last edited by phlipper; 06-16-2008 at 11:09 PM.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    The roads won't be any more slick than when it's raining. In fact the roads will be cleaner because there wont be the occasional drop of oil or gasoline dripping from all the oilchuggers.

    My thought is that solar will provide quite a bit of hydrogen. I only want to boost power/reduce gas. I don't want to convert away from gas, just cut it to perhaps 50%
    A real, honest, falsifiable claim made b.y Seer of dreams:(2011)
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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    Judging by the press release of the Honda FCX the car probably will be ready for a production run in 5 years or so... right now they seem like they are testing it with the public to see if it is particle, reliable and if it will stand up to the riggers of real world driving 15,000-20,000 miles a year in real world environment situations... these real world test will help them figure out ways to make it better and figure out how best this tech can be used and when it can be put into play... are they sharing this tech with other car companies? Was the engine designed by just Honda because I seem to remember hearing about all the other car companies trying this... is this just the first car that is ready for a real world test?

    Anyway anyone know how much the hydrogen cost to make? And how much hydrogen you will need to power the engine? And how much energy is used in the process of creating Hydrogen… I mean how much CO2 is created for each unit of hydrogen extracted?

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    That all depends. I was going to make my hydrogen using solar powered electrolosys. So that would equal 0 carbon per unit.

    I think honda is just the first company to try this. I doubt they are sharing. They want all teh profit/glory for themselves. I'll bet, though that as soon as they hit showroom's other retailers will be buying them and reverse engineering them.
    A real, honest, falsifiable claim made b.y Seer of dreams:(2011)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cnance View Post
    I believe there will be a nuclear war in October of this year.
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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord_jag View Post
    I think honda is just the first company to try this. I doubt they are sharing. They want all teh profit/glory for themselves.
    Didn't you click on the link I posted? All the car companies either have working models or designs for their own H-cars. Look to left side of the page.
    http://www.hydrogencarsnow.com/honda-fcx-clarity.htm
    Last edited by phlipper; 06-17-2008 at 02:07 PM.

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    Lord_jag's Avatar
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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    actually I didn't. I don't open any links when I'm at work. I'll go look now.
    A real, honest, falsifiable claim made b.y Seer of dreams:(2011)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cnance View Post
    I believe there will be a nuclear war in October of this year.
    Oh Cnance.... Full of shit as always.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    Quote Originally Posted by phlipper View Post
    Just wondering. Wouldn't the roads stay fairly slick from all the steam exhaust if all cars were burning hydrogen?
    Looks like some hydrogen cars are up and running. Fuel cells seem
    I'm not sure. It would depend on how much water is produced (something I have no idea about, but I'm pretty sure is small), but also what form the water is in. If it's already vapour, which I imagine it will be, then there probably won't be that much excess water on the roads.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    Quote Originally Posted by TheWhizKids View Post
    to make? And how much hydrogen you will need to power the engine? And how much energy is used in the process of creating Hydrogen… I mean how much CO2 is created for each unit of hydrogen extracted?
    Depends entirely on how the energy is produced. Hydrogen is just a means of transporting energy from one place (power plant) to another (your car). If we still burn coal to produce the energy for the hydrogen then we're not getting anywhere.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    jag, one of the problems is, it will take more energy to compress the hydrogen than you can get back by burning it.

    we use oil cause we found it laying around. its there for free, sort of. gotta pay somebody to pump it, transport it and refine it.

    we never used hydrogen cause there isn't any. in space, there is no oil or oxygen to burn it, and you only need enough energy to power one vehicle, not millions, so using expensive hydrogen makes some sense.

    its good to experiment with energy conservation ideas, but hydrogen is energy storage not energy production or conservation.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    as for using nuclear power, the enviromentalist's lawyers managed to close all the in progress plants and nobody dares try again. huge losses ( $$$ money, yours again ) were added to your electric bill for plants that were planned and started and could not be completed.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    jag, one of the problems is, it will take more energy to compress the hydrogen than you can get back by burning it.

    we use oil cause we found it laying around. its there for free, sort of. gotta pay somebody to pump it, transport it and refine it.

    we never used hydrogen cause there isn't any. in space, there is no oil or oxygen to burn it, and you only need enough energy to power one vehicle, not millions, so using expensive hydrogen makes some sense.

    its good to experiment with energy conservation ideas, but hydrogen is energy storage not energy production or conservation.
    Yes, yes, yes. I'm looking for a way to quickly recharge my car with a renewable resource. I am about $10K away from outfitting my house with solar panels. I'll put far more on than I need for my own power use, and I'll use the extra to produce hydrogen to run in my car. It will just be an expensive battery, but if it works, I could recharge this "battery" in about 5 minutes with a compresser using all the hydrogen I made all day (and all night if I run with a net-tied system)
    A real, honest, falsifiable claim made b.y Seer of dreams:(2011)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cnance View Post
    I believe there will be a nuclear war in October of this year.
    Oh Cnance.... Full of shit as always.

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    Re: hydrogen fuel

    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    jag, one of the problems is, it will take more energy to compress the hydrogen than you can get back by burning it.
    Actually, it's the breaking of the hydrogen bonds of the water molecule that takes most of the energy. Because of the inefficiencies of that process, somewhat less energy is produced, when the hydrogen if burned to again produce water and energy, than it took to produce the gas. I will defer to Kazaa for affirmation of this. In any case, there are some exciting technologies coming on line that will utilize nuclear energy in a whole lot cleaner manner than in the past and will not emit that evil CO2 gas. One of them is called Thorium power. Nuclear power will be one of the options for hydrogen production.

    Ten Essential Facts about Thorium.
    1. Thorium is a naturally occurring, slightly radioactive metal, and it has been considered as an alternative nuclear fuel to
    uranium.
    2. Unlike uranium, thorium is non-proliferative: The key advantage of the thorium fuel cycle is that it does NOT produce
    plutonium and is non-proliferative for that reason.
    3. The energy contained in one kilogram of thorium equals that of four thousand tons of coal.
    4. The energy stored in the earth's thorium reserves is thought to be greater than that available from all other conventional
    (fossil) and nuclear fuels combined.
    5. Thorium is cheaper and more abundant than uranium (approx three times more abundant in the Earth's crust than all
    forms of uranium combined).
    6. The thorium fuel cycle produces less radioactive waste than uranium (1,000 to 10,000 times less than in conventional
    reactors).
    7. Unlike natural uranium where only the 0.7% sliver of isotope 235 is fissionable, thorium is fully used in the fuel cycle.
    8. Unlike uranium, thorium can burn plutonium waste from traditional nuclear reactors with additional energy output.
    9. Unlike uranium, thorium is not suitable for the production of weapons-grade materials.
    10. Global reserves of thorium (India, Australia, Norway and the U.S. possess the largest reserves) could cover the world’s
    energy needs for thousands of years.
    Last edited by phlipper; 06-18-2008 at 08:32 AM.

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