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  1. #1
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    Let's get this straight once and for all.

    I've noticed that otherwise reasonable posters have been launching into foam-spitting rage whenever the topic of Islam comes up. How, exactly, DO you feel about Islam?

    Not the radical fringe, but Islam itself.
    Last edited by furbearingbrick; 06-26-2007 at 11:44 PM.
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  2. #2
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    As long as it's not radical islam, I have no problem with a person or families choice to be muslims. To each his own. Some muslims can be like christians in the fact that they don't take their religion to extreme. The bible has some bloody times and commands but most modern day christians don't follow that just like many peaceful muslims don't. It all depends on how obsessed somebody becomes with their religion as some obsessed christians have been known to be as obsessed as some muslims. I will say that I think that in this time there are more extreme muslims than extreme christians and I don't take radical islam lightly. But your average gas station worker and muslim you pass on the street is not out to kill you.

    The funny thing is that we both beleive in god and their history mimics some of christian history but we beleive Jesus was the son of god and the prophet and they beleive that allah was the prophet. The three major religions (judiasm, christianity and islam) all beleive in god, just have different intepretations of what pleases him, etc. Funny how christians and jews seem that they shouldn't get along since they deny jesus as the mesiah but yet christians seem to be so protective of israel - go figure.

  3. #3
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Button

    The funny thing is that we both beleive in god and their history mimics some of christian history but we beleive Jesus was the son of god and the prophet and they beleive that allah was the prophet. The three major religions (judiasm, christianity and islam) all beleive in god, just have different intepretations of what pleases him, etc. Funny how christians and jews seem that they shouldn't get along since they deny jesus as the mesiah but yet christians seem to be so protective of israel - go figure.
    I better straighten this out before somebody jumps on me. I beleive that we all beleive in god, the one and only. Muhammad split off with Islam claiming that he was the prophet. I do not beleive he was the prophet, however I do beleive that muslims are praying to the one true god, just like christians and jews are. However, each religion has interpreted a way to serve god that they think is pleasing to him, decided who was the prophet, etc. God will be the one to decide who is pleasing to him. He's probably looking down at us thinking we are nuts but I happen to beleive that jesus was his son. We all have wondered about the supreme being and I find it hard to beleive that muslims beleive in some false god, they don't, the beleive in the one being but they beleive that mohammad was the one that can relay (through their scriptures) the right way to serve him, the way to heaven, etc.

  4. #4
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    I don't have any problem with Islam, if that is a persons choice of faith, that's their business. I have a problem with people strapping bombs on themselves and their children, hijacking planes and flying them into buildings..and the list goes on, killing people that are innocent, and are just trying to get on with their daily lives.
    My hate for terrorist has nothing to do with their religion. I have the same loathing for so called christians that do the same type of things.

  5. #5
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by carolinahound
    I don't have any problem with Islam, if that is a persons choice of faith, that's their business. I have a problem with people strapping bombs on themselves and their children, hijacking planes and flying them into buildings..and the list goes on, killing people that are innocent, and are just trying to get on with their daily lives.
    My hate for terrorist has nothing to do with their religion. I have the same loathing for so called christians that do the same type of things.
    i guess you/we've fallen victim to the "why do bad things happen to good people ploy"!?another way to look at the bomber thing is a person decides to go to heaven and they just want company!?or they believe they are doing whats good for the others!?taking them to heaven!?of course,there are those that would be opposed if they didn't want to go to heaven!?do those types of people actually exist!?i'm sure we have all met a few!?but why would anyone want to go to heaven anyway!?isn't THIS WORLD heaven!?(for some!?)besides that,christianity says the innocent must die first,so that the guilty get to stay around and possibly repent!?hehe!!....just askn....
    Last edited by lexx; 06-27-2007 at 03:25 AM.
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  6. #6
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Button
    I better straighten this out before somebody jumps on me. I beleive that we all beleive in god, the one and only. Muhammad split off with Islam claiming that he was the prophet. I do not beleive he was the prophet, however I do beleive that muslims are praying to the one true god, just like christians and jews are. However, each religion has interpreted a way to serve god that they think is pleasing to him, decided who was the prophet, etc. God will be the one to decide who is pleasing to him. He's probably looking down at us thinking we are nuts but I happen to beleive that jesus was his son. We all have wondered about the supreme being and I find it hard to beleive that muslims beleive in some false god, they don't, the beleive in the one being but they beleive that mohammad was the one that can relay (through their scriptures) the right way to serve him, the way to heaven, etc.

    Born-again Bible-believing Christians do not pray to the same God as do Muslims, and visa versa.

    Allah and Jehovah are not the same God.

    Islam rejects Christ as God (Jehovah Himself) and also reject that Christ died on the cross for the sins of mankind.

    If a person rejects God the Son, they reject God the Father. No way around that.

    If a Muslim rejects God the Son, they reject the true Father.

    Any religion that rejects the truth that Christ is FULLY Jehovah and that He died and rose again after three days - any such religion is a false religion.

    And they must change their minds, they must repent.

    ****
    And I hope one day you'll come to the Lord and trust in Christ as your Savior.

  7. #7
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    jesus is NOT god!?why do you call ME good!?only the/my father is good!?and NO man can come to ME unless the/my FATHER draws him!?and who shall i say sends me lord,just say the great I AM!?or allah,or whatever!?hehe!!....just askn....
    i do not endorse/recommend any advertising on scam.com associated with my name /posts or otherwise. thank you

  8. #8
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx
    jesus is NOT god!?why do you call ME good!?only the/my father is good!?and NO man can come to ME unless the/my FATHER draws him!?and who shall i say sends me lord,just say the great I AM!?or allah,or whatever!?hehe!!....just askn....
    I agree, Jesus is who he says he is, "the son of God".

  9. #9
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    l dont think you can get anything straight when it concerns the beliefs and opinions of nearly every country.

    They are all bending and swaying to and fro, some get into high winds of lots of blowings and have a few of their branches break off, leaves leave (followers) others stay put and small but may get stood on by the bigger trunks or become covered up by the larger fractions.
    And a million other versions, govts are the same.

    But whats the point here being made...hahhhh

    Regardless of whose god is what god is where and why lets just for a tiny moment be still and take away all the names of these 'disputes' and any clothing or colour or accent and what do we have left ?????????

    Children, familys just like us, whom are all influenced by the powers that be, but remembering, how do these powers come to be?
    We vote, allow them in and we have them ourselves, there are most likely more suicides~death crimes in america than lslam and lran put together?

    Shivers l would dearly love the solution to heal all these upsets, or at least put them in to their respectives without causing distress and sadness and anger etc.

    Maybe its a matter of some good old Alchemy, yu know a bit of loving chemistry between humans, guess tho l will have to wait a while for that one to come out of the library in the original garden of passions desired...

    thanks take care

  10. #10
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Those were great posts Button. I would like to set the record straight about the name Allah. In arabic the word Allah just means "The God". That is used to seperate the One True God from any other God.
    We Muslims believe that the One True God (Allah) is the same as the One True God of the Old Testament of the Jews, and the One True God of the New Testament.

    An interesting fact is that in Christian churches in the Arab countries of the middle east. They use the word ""Allah" when talking about God. Also, the word Allah is written in Arab Bible translations whenever the word God is to be used.

    A few years ago Christian missionaries insisted that the Arabic Bibles drop using the name Allah to describe God. But the Arabic congregatios refused. Saying that "Allah" was a much more precise way to describe God.

  11. #11
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by Zilenna
    l dont think you can get anything straight when it concerns the beliefs and opinions of nearly every country.

    They are all bending and swaying to and fro, some get into high winds of lots of blowings and have a few of their branches break off, leaves leave (followers) others stay put and small but may get stood on by the bigger trunks or become covered up by the larger fractions.
    And a million other versions, govts are the same.

    But whats the point here being made...hahhhh

    Regardless of whose god is what god is where and why lets just for a tiny moment be still and take away all the names of these 'disputes' and any clothing or colour or accent and what do we have left ?????????

    Children, familys just like us, whom are all influenced by the powers that be, but remembering, how do these powers come to be?
    We vote, allow them in and we have them ourselves, there are most likely more suicides~death crimes in america than lslam and lran put together?

    Shivers l would dearly love the solution to heal all these upsets, or at least put them in to their respectives without causing distress and sadness and anger etc.

    Maybe its a matter of some good old Alchemy, yu know a bit of loving chemistry between humans, guess tho l will have to wait a while for that one to come out of the library in the original garden of passions desired...

    thanks take care
    What did you say???????? :confused: What did you mean??????? :confused:

  12. #12
    coontie is offline Vashudeva; Ferryman - doing the work... User Rank
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    I see the problem with Islam is that as these people become established in already otherwise established social circumstances, they are not willing to intergrate into such socities harmoniously. Once they establish a notable number of their following - Islam, next thing is that they will not go to schools with Jews and Christians and people of other beliefs and they want to establish shiryah law. They do not want to obsereve the established law/s of the land to which they are coming.
    I personally don't care. My position is, if, for instance they do not like the social structure of western countries then stay away.
    They can practice their religion and customs as they like and it wont effect others of which they do not want to harmoniously coexist.

  13. #13
    coontie is offline Vashudeva; Ferryman - doing the work... User Rank
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx
    i guess you/we've fallen victim to the "why do bad things happen to good people ploy"!?another way to look at the bomber thing is a person decides to go to heaven and they just want company!?or they believe they are doing whats good for the others!?taking them to heaven!?of course,there are those that would be opposed if they didn't want to go to heaven!?do those types of people actually exist!?i'm sure we have all met a few!?but why would anyone want to go to heaven anyway!?isn't THIS WORLD heaven!?(for some!?)besides that,christianity says the innocent must die first,so that the guilty get to stay around and possibly repent!?hehe!!....just askn....
    I think it is making a gross assumption for ANYONE to imply that they are going to Heaven, if there is such as place. FOr all we know they will just go from being a physically whole, living human being to $hit scattered all over the place. Especially considering the brutual, murderous act/s thay carry out on others.
    Actually, I don't give a $hit what anyone says, they are just insane maniacs!
    By the way, why is that these dumb young stiffs are blowing theirself up and noth the Imams and Osama that tell them this is the thing to do?
    It is obvious the ploy, eh?

  14. #14
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by coontie
    I see the problem with Islam is that as these people become established in already otherwise established social circumstances, they are not willing to intergrate into such socities harmoniously. Once they establish a notable number of their following - Islam, next thing is that they will not go to schools with Jews and Christians and people of other beliefs and they want to establish shiryah law. They do not want to obsereve the established law/s of the land to which they are coming.
    I personally don't care. My position is, if, for instance they do not like the social structure of western countries then stay away.
    They can practice their religion and customs as they like and it wont effect others of which they do not want to harmoniously coexist.
    Kind of like how the Christians have Christian only private schools. An want to make the 10 Commandments the only law of the land.

    And those Jews now have recognized holidays such as Passover and Hannaka. In fact, they are listed on every calender.

  15. #15
    sojustask's Avatar
    sojustask is offline The Late, Great Lady Mod - Retired User Rank
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Quote Originally Posted by EveryKnee
    Born-again Bible-believing Christians do not pray to the same God as do Muslims, and visa versa.

    Allah and Jehovah are not the same God.

    Islam rejects Christ as God (Jehovah Himself) and also reject that Christ died on the cross for the sins of mankind.

    If a person rejects God the Son, they reject God the Father. No way around that.

    If a Muslim rejects God the Son, they reject the true Father.

    Any religion that rejects the truth that Christ is FULLY Jehovah and that He died and rose again after three days - any such religion is a false religion.

    And they must change their minds, they must repent.

    ****
    And I hope one day you'll come to the Lord and trust in Christ as your Savior.

    Really? Well what God do we pray to if it isn't the same one the Muslims pray to? The Arab nation came from Hagar and Abraham's offspring, Ishmael.


    "And also of the son of the bondwoman will I make a nation, because he is thy seed"

    *Abraham loved Ishmael, too (cf. Gen. 17:18: 21:11,26);
    *Ishmael was blessed in his ways (17:20);
    *"God was with the lad" (=Ishmael; 21:20) - a very rare statement in the Torah!

    The Torah would not say all this about one who was "destined to be a lawless person."

    We should also bear in mind that Ishmael's religion, Islam, can certainly not be described as a religion of lawlessness. True, the Torah conveys more commandments than does the Koran, but that is mainly due to Israel's vocation as the "Kingdom of Priests" among the nations (with the Land Covenant as an integral part thereof). But the Koran has its own strict precepts and ordinances, many of them tailored to mend Ishmael's Abrahamite/Hamite double nature.

    Ishmael is one of the very few Biblical personages (besides Isaac and Solomon) whose names were ordained before their actual birth. That means there is a Divine intention expressed in these names and their bearers.
    ****************************************

    Ishmael, on the other hand, combined in himself the Divine spirit of Abraham and--through Hagar--also the heritage of Ham. The Hebrew word Ham means warm. It is the root for warmth, heat, and also for the color brown. In the genealogy of Noah's offspring, Ham is depicted as the ancestor of the Hamite peoples--usually identified as the dark-skinned peoples, or the peoples of the earth's tropical belt. In ancient times, Egypt and Babylon were their outstanding representatives.

    Noah's son Yephet, with Greece, Persia, and the peoples of the North as his descendants, stands for beauty and intellect, in their positive as well as in their deceptive qualities. From S(h)em, literally "name," derive the peoples of the Semitic languages and cultures. The Torah, however, applies this te.rm solely to the sons of Israel, as the people or bearer of the (Divine) Name. (Cf. Numb.6:27; Deut. 28:10). Adversaries are consequently called anti-Semites, even if they belong to a people of Semitic language.

    Ishmael and his descendants attained, in the form of Islam, the position of a leading world power, and incorporated the Land of Israel into its realm (which it ter.ms Dar-es-Salam--the "abode of Islam"). Just as Israel was not meant to remain under Pharaoh's rule in ancient times, in modern times--with the termination of its exile and submission under the rule of the nations--Israel is being re-established in the land of its destiny, the "Land of the Fathers." This event puts Ishmael's descendants--Islam and the Arab nations--to the test as to whether they will yield to their inherited Egyptian/Pharaonic trait, or to Abraham's heritage. Zion is the "test stone" also in this respect (Cf. Is.28:16, where the Hebrew word even bohan means test stone, not testing stone).

    In perfect keeping with this, the Koran, the book of the religion of Ishmael, warns its adherents duly and repeatedly not to go in Pharaoh's way (cf. Surah 73, "Enwrapped," v. 15,ff.). The Koran even takes this one step further: it has Pharaoh, when he saw his army drowning, doing repentance, and confessing: "I believe that there is no god but He in Whom the Children of Israel believe; I am of those that surrender" (Surah "Jonah", 92). This, is not to be taken as a recommendation to postpone repentance until after the drowning of the army. Rather, it is foremost upon us, the descendants of Abraham, via Isaac as well as via Ishmael, to recognize our respective vocations for the sake of the benefit of all. It was for the sake of this end that Sarai/Sarah was kept barren till Ishmael was born.

    Father Abraham foresaw the struggle in which his son Ishmael would be entangled. Therefore, when told by the Lord that in spite of his advanced age he would bear a son from Sarah, Abraham prayed (Gen. 17:18): "O that Ishmael might live before thee".

    Abraham loved both his sons, Ishmael and Isaac, therefore he had to be told: "Take now thy son, thine only one whom you have loved, even Isaac..." (Gen. 22:2).The specification "even Isaac," was to tell him which of his two beloved sons he was to bring to Mt. Moriah.

    Abraham did not merely pray "that Ishmael might live." He was not concerned that Ishmael would be threatened by Isaac, and would need a special prayer for protection from his brother. Abraham was concerned that Ishmael--born from Hagar, and biologically the firstborn--might try to take the whole heritage for himself, thus depriving Isaac of God's promise. Abraham's prayer that Ishmael might live before the Lord, was meant to encourage and guide Ismael to let the spiritual--Abrahamic-- inheritance prevail, that Ishmael would be alive in the Divine spirit, and consequently recognize also Isaac's call.

    The two brothers and their descendants were not to fight over the inheritance, but rather"compete in good works," as the Koran, Ishmael's guide book, so aptly says.

    In the spirit of our father Abraham, let us pray: "Oh, that both of us, Ishmael and Israel, might live before Thee."



    http://www.vibrani.com/Sarah.htm

    I hate to break it to you but the "Christian" God was the God of Islam and Israel first. They've had a long running relationship with Him.

    .
    Last edited by sojustask; 06-27-2007 at 07:44 AM.

  16. #16
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    Re: Let's get this straight once and for all.

    Really good post Lady Mod :)

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