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  1. #1
    dchristie's Avatar
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    Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    It's a funny thing. It smells better around here lately. I've been noticing some of the usual resident right-wing rodents like Frankie "Sh!t For Brains" "Pwmoron" and the other vermin seem to have spontaneously scurried back into their holes.

    Did they get banned? Did they shoot their mouths off in the wrong place at the wrong time to the wrong person somewhere and ended up in the IC Unit at a local hospital? Did they finally just get tired of being exposed as blithering brainless fools time after time here and went off to that vast fascist garbage dump at FreeRepublic to play with their fellow rat vermin un-molested by the truth?

    One thing we know for sure. None of them has enlisted.

    That would be a nice present from Santa. Good riddance to bad trash.

    __________________________________________________ ______________________


    Top Ten Things Not to Do in Iraq


    By Ivan Eland
    December 19, 2006

    Editor's Note: George W. Bush seems determined to "double down" his bet on the Iraq War despite overwhelming public opposition and recommendations for a phased withdrawal from the bipartisan Iraq Study Group. Bush is now toying with the idea of adding 15,000 to 30,000 more U.S. troops, a scheme called "The Surge."

    While many of Bush's neoconservative advisers are in favor, the President is running into opposition from the top Pentagon brass, including the entire Joint Chiefs of Staff, according to a Washington Post article on Dec. 19. Clearly, however, prospects for an early end to the U.S. military occupation of Iraq continue to dim.

    In this guest essay, the Independent Institute's Ivan Eland takes note of that fact and offers his Top Ten list of things not to do in Iraq:

    Ever since the Iraq Study Group (ISG) issued its recommendations, the debate in Washington has swirled around what to do about the mess in Iraq. Unfortunately, both the recommendations of the study group and the contradictory inclinations of the Bush administration are “bridges to nowhere.”
    Share this article

    Both groups are in denial about the chaos in Iraq and are not yet ready to offer the tough solutions that could stabilize the country. Perhaps they should accept the top ten things not to do in Iraq:

    1. Don’t send more U.S. troops. By pursuing this course, neoconservative armchair generals—such as Frederick Kagan—who helped Bush get into this mess, want to help him dig the hole deeper. Yet the senior U.S. military officers on the ground in the Middle East are not keen on this option. They realize that the quagmire makes it impossible for U.S. forces to ever succeed, and they have been inclined toward withdrawal. Former Secretary of State and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Colin Powell seemed to reflect their views when he said that when deciding whether to send more troops, “I’d want to have a clear understanding of what it is they’re going for, how long they’re going for. And let’s be clear about something else.… There really are no additional troops. All we would be doing is keeping some of the troops who were there, there longer and escalating or accelerating the arrival of other troops.” Without having a clearly defined reason for sending more troops, the policy collapses into the usual “show the Iraqis and the domestic political audience that the Bush administration means business.” But the domestic political audience has long soured on the war and wants the troops to begin coming home and the Iraqis, like Powell, realize that the troop increase is not sustainable in the long-term.

    2. Don’t think that sending more U.S. troops is politically sustainable. In a democracy, putting more troops and money into a war that has lost public support rivals the stupidity of invading a country to bring democracy to a fragmented society with no prior democratic experience or culture.

    3. Don’t use any extra forces to secure Baghdad. The Bush administration can’t seem to accept what the U.S. military command in Iraq has said: that more U.S. forces will only inflame Iraqi resistance. Recently, when the United States moved forces from other parts of Iraq into Baghdad, in an attempt to increase Baghdad’s security, violence flared in reaction to the augmented U.S. troop presence.

    4. Don’t use any extra U.S. troops to train Iraqi forces. Even if the Iraqi army and police could be made larger and better quickly—which they can’t be—the biggest difficulty is not their competence. The main problem is that they will fight for their religious sect, ethnic group, or tribe, not for their country.

    5. Don’t think that training Iraqi security forces is a viable U.S. exit strategy. Because of the fragmented nature of Iraqi society, training such forces is merely enabling one side’s combatants in an accelerating civil war. Many of those already trained are now operating as Shi’ite death squads attacking Sunnis.

    6. Don’t think that the ISG’s proposed withdrawal of combat forces by early 2008, while retaining about half the 140,000 troops to train Iraqi forces, is a viable solution. In addition to making the long-term situation in Iraq worse (see item #5), this proposal was merely a “cut and hide” strategy by the bipartisan foreign policy elite to diminish the importance of Iraq in the 2008 elections. If combat troops are withdrawn, the less visible training mission would incur fewer U.S. casualties and generate less intense media coverage back home during the next election season.

    7. Don’t pursue the “80 percent solution.” This proposal would abandon any attempt at reconciliation with the Sunnis and throw all of the diminishing U.S. influence behind the groups that effectively control the Iraqi government: the Shi’a, which make up 60 percent of Iraq’s population, and the Kurds, which make up another 20 percent. After the invasion, U.S. support defaulted to the Shi’a and Kurds because they were opposed to the rising Sunni insurgency. But the Shi’a have become more militant, have turned southern Iraq into an intolerant Islamic state, and have come under the influence of their sectarian brethren in Iran. Many of the Sunni guerrillas are thugs, but at least most are not religious militants. Besides, for long-term stability, all groups—including the Sunnis—have to be satisfied enough with any political settlement to attempt to quell violence from their members.

    8. Don’t think that talking to Syria and Iran will pay big dividends in Iraq. Right after the invasion, these countries were afraid that they would be next and thus were more amenable to helping out the United States. Now, they are both delighted that they have the United States over a barrel—that is, bogged down in a quagmire and less likely to put them in the cross hairs. So they will be in no hurry to help U.S. forces extricate themselves from the tar baby. Although assistance to various groups in Iraq is coming from Syria and Iran, Iraqi violence appears to be funded mainly through kidnappings and organized crime. Thus, although talks should be initiated with Syria and Iran, even if they agree to help, that help will not dampen most of Iraq’s violence.

    9. Don’t continue talking about democracy or victory in Iraq. Neither is possible, and such rhetoric makes withdrawal harder before either is achieved.

    10. Don’t think Iraq can exist as a unified country. Iraq already has decentralized governance and militias dominating various areas. The United States should mediate a conclave of all Iraqi groups to recognize this decentralized governance and to negotiate a viable oil sharing agreement. The decentralization option is the only one that has any hope of reducing and compartmentalizing the violence. At this late date, however, even this option might not prevent unbridled mayhem.

  2. #2
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    Quote Originally Posted by dchristie
    It's a funny thing. It smells better around here lately. I've been noticing some of the usual resident right-wing rodents like Frankie "Sh!t For Brains" "Pwmoron" and the other vermin seem to have spontaneously scurried back into their holes.
    Quote Originally Posted by dchristie
    Did they get banned? Did they shoot their mouths off in the wrong place at the wrong time to the wrong person somewhere and ended up in the IC Unit at a local hospital? Did they finally just get tired of being exposed as blithering brainless fools time after time here and went off to that vast fascist garbage dump at FreeRepublic to play with their fellow rat vermin un-molested by the truth?

    One thing we know for sure. None of them has enlisted.

    That would be a nice present from Santa. Good riddance to bad trash.

    __________________________________________________ ______________________


    Top Ten Things Not to Do in Iraq


    By Ivan Eland
    December 19, 2006

    Editor's Note: George W. Bush seems determined to "double down" his bet on the Iraq War despite overwhelming public opposition and recommendations for a phased withdrawal from the bipartisan Iraq Study Group. Bush is now toying with the idea of adding 15,000 to 30,000 more U.S. troops, a scheme called "The Surge."

    While many of Bush's neoconservative advisers are in favor, the President is running into opposition from the top Pentagon brass, including the entire Joint Chiefs of Staff, according to a Washington Post article on Dec. 19. Clearly, however, prospects for an early end to the U.S. military occupation of Iraq continue to dim.

    In this guest essay, the Independent Institute's Ivan Eland takes note of that fact and offers his Top Ten list of things not to do in Iraq:

    Ever since the Iraq Study Group (ISG) issued its recommendations, the debate in Washington has swirled around what to do about the mess in Iraq. Unfortunately, both the recommendations of the study group and the contradictory inclinations of the Bush administration are “bridges to nowhere.”
    Share this article

    Both groups are in denial about the chaos in Iraq and are not yet ready to offer the tough solutions that could stabilize the country. Perhaps they should accept the top ten things not to do in Iraq:

    1. Don’t send more U.S. troops. By pursuing this course, neoconservative armchair generals—such as Frederick Kagan—who helped Bush get into this mess, want to help him dig the hole deeper. Yet the senior U.S. military officers on the ground in the Middle East are not keen on this option. They realize that the quagmire makes it impossible for U.S. forces to ever succeed, and they have been inclined toward withdrawal. Former Secretary of State and Chairman of the Joint Chiefs of Staff Colin Powell seemed to reflect their views when he said that when deciding whether to send more troops, “I’d want to have a clear understanding of what it is they’re going for, how long they’re going for. And let’s be clear about something else.… There really are no additional troops. All we would be doing is keeping some of the troops who were there, there longer and escalating or accelerating the arrival of other troops.” Without having a clearly defined reason for sending more troops, the policy collapses into the usual “show the Iraqis and the domestic political audience that the Bush administration means business.” But the domestic political audience has long soured on the war and wants the troops to begin coming home and the Iraqis, like Powell, realize that the troop increase is not sustainable in the long-term.

    2. Don’t think that sending more U.S. troops is politically sustainable. In a democracy, putting more troops and money into a war that has lost public support rivals the stupidity of invading a country to bring democracy to a fragmented society with no prior democratic experience or culture.

    3. Don’t use any extra forces to secure Baghdad. The Bush administration can’t seem to accept what the U.S. military command in Iraq has said: that more U.S. forces will only inflame Iraqi resistance. Recently, when the United States moved forces from other parts of Iraq into Baghdad, in an attempt to increase Baghdad’s security, violence flared in reaction to the augmented U.S. troop presence.

    4. Don’t use any extra U.S. troops to train Iraqi forces. Even if the Iraqi army and police could be made larger and better quickly—which they can’t be—the biggest difficulty is not their competence. The main problem is that they will fight for their religious sect, ethnic group, or tribe, not for their country.

    5. Don’t think that training Iraqi security forces is a viable U.S. exit strategy. Because of the fragmented nature of Iraqi society, training such forces is merely enabling one side’s combatants in an accelerating civil war. Many of those already trained are now operating as Shi’ite death squads attacking Sunnis.

    6. Don’t think that the ISG’s proposed withdrawal of combat forces by early 2008, while retaining about half the 140,000 troops to train Iraqi forces, is a viable solution. In addition to making the long-term situation in Iraq worse (see item #5), this proposal was merely a “cut and hide” strategy by the bipartisan foreign policy elite to diminish the importance of Iraq in the 2008 elections. If combat troops are withdrawn, the less visible training mission would incur fewer U.S. casualties and generate less intense media coverage back home during the next election season.

    7. Don’t pursue the “80 percent solution.” This proposal would abandon any attempt at reconciliation with the Sunnis and throw all of the diminishing U.S. influence behind the groups that effectively control the Iraqi government: the Shi’a, which make up 60 percent of Iraq’s population, and the Kurds, which make up another 20 percent. After the invasion, U.S. support defaulted to the Shi’a and Kurds because they were opposed to the rising Sunni insurgency. But the Shi’a have become more militant, have turned southern Iraq into an intolerant Islamic state, and have come under the influence of their sectarian brethren in Iran. Many of the Sunni guerrillas are thugs, but at least most are not religious militants. Besides, for long-term stability, all groups—including the Sunnis—have to be satisfied enough with any political settlement to attempt to quell violence from their members.

    8. Don’t think that talking to Syria and Iran will pay big dividends in Iraq. Right after the invasion, these countries were afraid that they would be next and thus were more amenable to helping out the United States. Now, they are both delighted that they have the United States over a barrel—that is, bogged down in a quagmire and less likely to put them in the cross hairs. So they will be in no hurry to help U.S. forces extricate themselves from the tar baby. Although assistance to various groups in Iraq is coming from Syria and Iran, Iraqi violence appears to be funded mainly through kidnappings and organized crime. Thus, although talks should be initiated with Syria and Iran, even if they agree to help, that help will not dampen most of Iraq’s violence.

    9. Don’t continue talking about democracy or victory in Iraq. Neither is possible, and such rhetoric makes withdrawal harder before either is achieved.

    10. Don’t think Iraq can exist as a unified country. Iraq already has decentralized governance and militias dominating various areas. The United States should mediate a conclave of all Iraqi groups to recognize this decentralized governance and to negotiate a viable oil sharing agreement. The decentralization option is the only one that has any hope of reducing and compartmentalizing the violence. At this late date, however, even this option might not prevent unbridled mayhem.


    You are such an UGLY person, it must suck to wake up as you every morning. Do yourself a favor, end it.
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you always got"

    National Taxes, National Borders!!

    NO AMNESTY FOR ILLEGALS!

  3. #3
    dchristie's Avatar
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronster
    [B]



    You are such an UGLY person, it must suck to wake up as you every morning. Do yourself a favor, end it.
    LOL... Is that all you've got, you pathetic loser? Nothing could suck as much as having to look at that retarded thing staring back at you in the mirror everyday. Do your family a favor. Become an organ donor. Then blow your brains out.

  4. #4
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    :rolleyes: This is helping?? :rolleyes:

  5. #5
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    Nice to see the holidays bring out the best in people.

  6. #6
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    Nice find DC. The article certainly points out the utter stupidity of this administration. There's no doubt that the Bush administrations' diplomatic style has been extraordinarily counter-productive. They have never listened to anyone, not even their own Republican Party. And this new policy of adding more troops is as moronic as all their other decisions.
    They just don't comprehend what everyone, including the Pentagon, is telling them. As one Iraqi reporter put it "Sending more troops will make things more complicated. It will increase more clashes. And this myth of destroying al-Sadr's movement is just a big joke, because al-Sadr movement is expected or, like, estimated to contain around five million Iraqis. So, I don't know how many U.S. troops have to be sent to destroy five million Iraqis".
    And when more Americans are put on Iraqi soil you can bet that more Iraqis will join al-Sadr's movement or one of the myriad other groups who want us out. Escalation had the same effect in Viet Nam, but what would Bush know about Viet Nam.

  7. #7
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    i dunno the last one was the best damn suggestion yet, why do we have to leave Iraq as one unified country, split it up and let the sects govern themselves...

  8. #8
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    dunno the last one was the best damn suggestion yet, why do we have to leave Iraq as one unified country, split it up and let the sects govern themselves...
    May be too late? They all want the whole enchilada? They really don't give a rats arse what the United States has in mind? They have already seen that and that is why we are where we are to date!

    Escalation had the same effect in Viet Nam, but what would Bush know about Viet Nam.
    We dropped enough bombs (Not including rockets, napalm, small arms ammunition and what ever else we had in the arsenal) in Vietnam to blow up every square inch of land on the planet and for some reason still couldn't make an impact? Vietnam is about the same size as Florida by the way?

    You can't go in there and tell them they are free to make their own decisions and then outline what their decisions will be?

  9. #9
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    Quote Originally Posted by dchristie
    LOL... Is that all you've got, you pathetic loser? Nothing could suck as much as having to look at that retarded thing staring back at you in the mirror everyday. Do your family a favor. Become an organ donor. Then blow your brains out.

    HA, yea.... I am thanking God or whoever is up there that I am not you. You are UGLY on the inside... Hey just like Rosie O Donnel, oh snap... I bet you ARE Rosie O Donnel, prentending to be someone else. HAHAH. I see it now.
    "If you always do what you've always done, you'll always get what you always got"

    National Taxes, National Borders!!

    NO AMNESTY FOR ILLEGALS!

  10. #10
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    Iraq is not our only problem,,,,,,,,
    How will we save America from almost certain destruction, our leader is insane and this is no longer in debate.
    What do we do about it?


    Saturday, December 09, 2006
    Captain Queeg of the Good Ship America

    It appears now that George W. Bush just absolutely doesn't get it. Offered a sort of way out of the incredible mess he has made (once again by his Daddy's friends) he petulantly refuses to accept it and insists that we are going to "win" a "war" that was lost before it began. While I don't think the Baker Commission was any great shakes (see Greg Palast) at least they tried to give Georgie a chance to change direction (which he is apparently going to refuse). On the internet, if not elsewhere, there are increasing calls for Bush to "go." Some are suggesting impeachment, others that he should be forced to resign (along with Cheney). Given the personalities of Bush and Cheney (and their obvious fear of being held accountable for their war crimes) this seems highly unlikely. Besides, there are the obvious practical problems that would have to be overcome (like who would replace them). Somewhere I saw that the best strategy would be to force Cheney out first, replace him with a new Vice-Pres.ident, then force out Bush to be replaced by the new VP. This makes sense but will probably never happen. Republicans would probably insist the new VP be Tom DeLay or Newt Gingrich, or perhaps even Lieberman. If this is not going to happen what in the world is going to happen? Are we supposed to survive another two years with this apparently insane man at the helm of the Ship of State? Bush seems to be as delusional as Hitler in his final bunker, still insisting that his no longer existing army fight on to victory, the cavalry is just around the corner, the good guys always win, God is on our side, only he, his wife and dog understand the way to victory, he is right and all the rest of the world is wrong. Dealing with the delusionally insane is not easy as you no doubt all know, especially when it is being supported by the full weight of corporate power who could care less about insanity and far more about short term profits.

    This impossible situation is about to come to a climax. Will democrats just ignore it and pass a new minimum wage, let bygones be bygones, and continue to support this immoral and doomed "war," or will they finally stand up for what is right and proper for our troubled country (an idea that seems to have been lost in the insatiable lust for money that now characterizes our political system). Up with their skirts and down with their pants. It's the American way.
    http://morialekafa.blogspot.com/2006...p-america.html

    On Captain Queeg for those unfamiliar with The Caine Mutinty:

    In 1951 Herman Wouk wrote a Pulitzer-Prize winning novel entitled The Caine Mutiny, starring the fictional Captain Phillip Francis Queeg. The 1954 film starring Humphrey Bogart as Captain Queeg received seven Oscar nominations. If you haven't read the book, or seen the movie, in the last few years, it's worth a trip to the bookstore or the movie store to refresh your memory.

    In The Caine Mutiny Captain Queeg is a Navy captain of the U.S.S. Caine DMS-18, a fictional Destroyer Mine Sweeper, in the Pacific war against Japan, World War II. Captain Queeg is, unfortunately, a Captain unclear on the concept. He is far more concerned about his own safety, and the safety of his ship, and about who ate his strawberries, than he is about fighting and winning a war. When ordered to escort a Marine landing craft in an island invasion, he withdraws before coming within range of enemy fire, leaving the Marines unescorted, and, of course, without bringing his own guns within range of the enemy, thus defeating the purpose of having guns, or a warship, or a Navy, at all.

    Captain Queeg kept two steel balls in his pocket, and when having an anxiety attack, nervous and indecisive, which was much of the time, would take them out and roll them around in his hand, an image which evokes a certain symbolism that was apparently lost on most reviewers, but probably not on Herman Wouk.

  11. #11
    Born2Serve Guest

    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    I vote for dividing the country into 3states 1.Iraqistan for the kurds 2.Shiitestan for the iranian puppets 3.baathistan for the syrian puppets lol

  12. #12
    dchristie's Avatar
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    Quote Originally Posted by Ronster
    HA, yea.... I am thanking God or whoever is up there that I am not you. You are UGLY on the inside... Hey just like Rosie O Donnel, oh snap... I bet you ARE Rosie O Donnel, prentending to be someone else. HAHAH. I see it now.
    LOL… If you can say thanks to it, we can be sure as hell it isn’t GOD up there. It's more likely one of The Flying Monkey’s hemorrhoids. You'd better be careful and cling real tight to it now. Since Rumsfeld got the boot, Der Monkey has somebody new to wipe his ass who might even have a clue what they're doing. When you hear a flushing sound, hold your breath.
    Last edited by dchristie; 12-22-2006 at 12:25 AM.

  13. #13
    Born2Serve Guest

    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    who is diechrist? dchristie? not the commie pinko liberal...

  14. #14
    dchristie's Avatar
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    Quote Originally Posted by Born2Serve
    who is diechrist? dchristie? not the commie pinko liberal...
    LOL Another crazed Repudlickin degenerate dirtbag from the pit of Hell. Shouldn't that be Born2Perv?
    Last edited by dchristie; 12-22-2006 at 12:44 AM.

  15. #15
    Born2Serve Guest

    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    So You Are The Diechrist Roflmao What A Flaming Retard

  16. #16
    dchristie's Avatar
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    Re: Top Ten Things Not To Do In The Iraq-Nam Fiasco

    Quote Originally Posted by Born2Serve
    So You Are The Diechrist Roflmao What A Flaming Retard
    LOL.. Thanks. That put's me about 160 IQ points above you. Tell us: How does it feel to be able to suck your own pud?

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