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  1. #1
    sojustask's Avatar
    sojustask is offline The Late, Great Lady Mod - Retired User Rank
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    You're under arrest.

    You're under arrest

    For what?

    Shut up. None of your &%##ing business.



    As of October 17th we, all of us, are just one indiscretion, misunderstanding or set up away from disappearing.

    Maybe that neighbor you pissed off a couple of years ago will be the reason. Or a phone call to an old buddy during which you vented your frustrations with the president. It could be an email someone sent you that you liked and forwarded to someone else.

    But the reason you end up in federal custody, refused a lawyer, or a trial, may never be known, to you or anyone else.

    “Get outta here. I'm a US citizen. That kind of stuff only happens to foreign terrorists.”

    No. You get outta here. As of October 17th it can happen, and it can happen to YOU.

    Here's the full text of the law President Bush signed yesterday. Read it yourself. Senator Chris Dodd did and concludes that,


    "Anybody deemed by the president to be an enemy combatant or alleged enemy combatant can be arrested and held indefinitely," he said. "That's incredible. Today, an American president signed that bill into law. What a sad day for our country."


    So, be warned. Today would be a good day to reconsider almost everything you think you know about what it means to be an American citizen. In fact, as of October 17th, common criminals... murderers, thieves, rapists, even child molesters, now have more legal protections than any American accused by the government of “providing material aid to terrorists.”

    For example, if someone is accused of murdering their entire family, burning down their house and raping the family pets, they still have the right to:

    1) One phone call
    2) To refuse to answer questions without a lawyer present
    3) The right to a preliminary hearing forcing prosecutors to prove they have a case
    4) The right to Habeas Corpus
    5) The right to examine and refute the evidence against them -- all the evidence.
    6) The right cross examine your accusers - all accusers.

    But, should the US government accuse you of "providing material aid to terrorists:"

    1) You have NO right to phone anyone – maybe ever again
    2) You have NO right to any kind of evidential hearing
    3) You have NO right to Habeas Corpus
    4) You have NO right to see the evidence against you
    5) You have NO right to confront, or even know the identity of, witnesses against you
    6) You haver NO right to a jury of your peers.

    And you can be subjected to extreme interrogation techniques the government says do not constitute torture, but refuse to describe.

    Think I'm kidding? Nope. Even I'm not that sick. This is no joke. I wish it were. No this one is the real deal folks. And since it's now the law of the land, you better get rid of your pre-10/17/2006 thinking. It's a new day and a new way in Bush's America.

    Piss off someone in government and you could find yourself in front of precisely the kind of military tribunals the US once condemned in other countries. Here are some of the “highlights” of the new law.

    Who can be accused of being an “Unlawful Enemy Combatant?” Anyone they decide. And oh, by the way, it's retroactive (ex post facto) to boot.


    “Determination of Unlawful Enemy Combatant Status Dispositive- A finding, whether before, on, or after the date of the enactment of the Military Commissions Act of 2006, by a Combatant Status Review Tribunal or another competent tribunal established under the authority of the President or the Secretary of Defense that a person is an unlawful enemy combatant is dispositive for purposes of jurisdiction for trial by military commission under this chapter.

    And forget sentencing guidelines. Under this law your punishment can be affected by whether Don Rumsfeld is in a good mood that day or a bad mood.


    “Punishments- A military commission under this chapter may, under such limitations as the Secretary of Defense may prescribe, adjudge any punishment not forbidden by this chapter, including the penalty of death when authorized under this chapter or the law of war.


    And just who can convene a Military Tribunal under this new law?


    “Military commissions under this chapter may be convened by the Secretary of Defense or by any officer or official of the United States designated by the Secretary for that purpose.


    Who will judge you?


    “In General- Any commissioned officer of the armed forces on active duty is eligible to serve on a military commission under this chapter.”


    Once seated a Military Tribunal assumes a status once reserved only for the Pope: infallibility.

    “ No authority convening a military commission under this chapter may censure, reprimand, or admonish the military commission, or any member, military judge, or counsel thereof, with respect to the findings or sentence adjudged by the military commission, or with respect to any other exercises of its or his functions in the conduct of the proceedings.”

    Well, at least we can watch the proceedings, right? Forget about it.


    “The military judge may close to the public all or a portion of the proceedings under paragraph (1) only upon making a specific finding that such closure is necessary...”


    There's nothing in the new law that requires a speedy trial. So after months, or even years, of cooling your heels in solitary you may finally be led before a tribunal for your day in court. Will you find out now why you're under arrest. Maybe not.


    NATIONAL SECURITY PRIVILEGE- (A) Classified information shall be protected and is privileged from disclosure if disclosure would be detrimental to the national security. The rule in the preceding sentence applies to all stages of the proceedings of military commissions under this chapter..... The privilege referred may be claimed by the head of the executive or military department or government agency concerned based on a finding by the head of that department or agency...”


    And just who can claim the evidence against you is “privileged?”



    “A person who may claim the privilege referred to in subparagraph (A) may authorize a representative, witness, or trial counsel to claim the privilege and make the finding described in subparagraph (B) on behalf of such person. “


    In other words, anyone on the prosecution side of the case, including their witnesses against you, can declare that the evidence they have against you is privileged and therefore can be kept from you and your attorney.


    K. broke off here and looked at the judge, who said nothing. As he did so he thought he saw the judge use a movement of his eyes to give a sign to someone in the crowd. K. smiled and said, "And now the judge is giving a secret sign to someone among you. There seems to be someone among you who is taking directions from above. I don't know whether the sign is meant to produce booing or applause, but I'll resist trying to guess what its meaning is too soon. It really doesn't matter to me, and I give his lordship the judge my full and public permission to stop giving secret signs to his paid subordinate down there and give his orders in words instead; let him just say "Boo now!," and then the next time "Clap now!". (Franz Kafka, The Trial.)

    If there is anything more extraordinary than the law Bush signed yesterday it was the lack of commotion about it. It would seem American's, who once warned authorities “Don't tread on me,” are now resigned to a Kafkaesque future.

    So, from today on, until and if a future congress and president repeals this assualt on “equal justice for all,” you all better watch your step -- and your mouth.

    http://www.newsforreal.com

    .

  2. #2
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    Re: You're under arrest.

    So, from today on, until and if a future congress and president repeals this assualt on “equal justice for all,” you all better watch your step -- and your mouth
    I always do , besides Lady Mod , us regular americans will be un-affected
    Originally posted by Americanadian
    Palin: Omit the "i" and you're left with "Pain".

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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Nice article but I've really been considering keeping my mouth shut these days.

  4. #4
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    sojustask is offline The Late, Great Lady Mod - Retired User Rank
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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Quote Originally Posted by franKg
    I always do , besides Lady Mod , us regular americans will be un-affected
    That would be someone other than you? You are a good little Russian subject, scared to speak out about the wrongs your government does.

    That is NOT the American way. But you should do well in communist Russia.


    Lady Mod

  5. #5
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    sojustask is offline The Late, Great Lady Mod - Retired User Rank
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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Button
    Nice article but I've really been considering keeping my mouth shut these days.
    It is only in numbers and willingness to confront tyranny that we can overcome tyranny.

    Lady Mod

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    Re: You're under arrest.

    This is the scariest, most un-American law ever passed by this country. I haven't posted in some time, but this legislation frightens me. I am a constitutionalist, and this law spits in the very face of that document. I know most Americans will say, 'But if you aren't a terrorist, you have nothing to worry about.' To you I say enjoy your mock 'freedoms', they are long gone. There are cases throughout our history when our government has abused the very citizens it is sworn to protect. This law WILL be abused, and you will never know about it because of the secrecy allowed within this law.

  7. #7
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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiplash
    This is the scariest, most un-American law ever passed by this country. I haven't posted in some time, but this legislation frightens me. I am a constitutionalist, and this law spits in the very face of that document. I know most Americans will say, 'But if you aren't a terrorist, you have nothing to worry about.' To you I say enjoy your mock 'freedoms', they are long gone. There are cases throughout our history when our government has abused the very citizens it is sworn to protect. This law WILL be abused, and you will never know about it because of the secrecy allowed within this law.
    Precisely, look how many years they kept the prisoners hidden away from our notice in the "Secret CIA prisons" until Bush decided to parade them out in order to get this legislation into law?

    Now that he has his law, he doesn't have to make anything public anymore. We have officially entered a Military Police state.

    Lady Mod
    Last edited by sojustask; 10-20-2006 at 05:01 AM.

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    Re: You're under arrest.

    First the patriot act, then warentless wiretapping,and now this. Whats next?All you gun lovers better watch out Bush is on a roll!!!He is spitting on our founding fathers graves.Honestly though this is no time for shutting up this is when more than ever we need to be screaming at the top of our lungs.These so called represenatives who are supposed to represent our wishs and our best interests are rolling over and playing dead as if they were Bushs lap dogs.If they wont say or do anything its our right and obligation to do so.Now the question is what? What can we do?Anyone here have the courage still to give their ideas or thoughts?

  9. #9
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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Quote Originally Posted by Indie
    First the patriot act, then warentless wiretapping,and now this. Whats next?All you gun lovers better watch out Bush is on a roll!!!He is spitting on our founding fathers graves.Honestly though this is no time for shutting up this is when more than ever we need to be screaming at the top of our lungs.These so called represenatives who are supposed to represent our wishs and our best interests are rolling over and playing dead as if they were Bushs lap dogs.If they wont say or do anything its our right and obligation to do so.Now the question is what? What can we do?Anyone here have the courage still to give their ideas or thoughts?
    The thing is, will this country try and scream if they did want to take away our arms? They would have most of the brainwashed people in this country thinking that it's for our saftey and to defeat terrorism. It'll probably have to be done slowly with lots of little laws put on types of firearms, etc. I used to think that the assualt weapons ban was from people who generally had good intentions but now with the wiretapping thing, this new military tribunal thing with no right to even know what you've been locked up for - I might pee my pants if I hear wind of new legislation about guns. Scary thing is, for some dems that's what they want. I guess the whole governments wants to bend us over and let us have it :confused:

    Another scary thing - if it was the dems trying to take away guns or most guns, the republicans would be screaming bloody murder, but if Bush tried to do it, I think the republicans would praise the president in his war on terror.

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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Sigh.....looks like its time for our daily dose of liberal parnoid delusion, does anyone here not think that in 10 years or so we will be not at all out war with Islamo-fascists?

    Terrorism is not going away and if Al-queda had been around in 1776 then our constitution would've been drastically different that what it presently is

    Yet again its obvious that you people endorse the "turn our backs" strategy to fight terrorism, or to be politcally correct " The struggle against religious freedom fighters"
    Last edited by franKg; 10-19-2006 at 11:02 PM.
    Originally posted by Americanadian
    Palin: Omit the "i" and you're left with "Pain".

  11. #11
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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Quote Originally Posted by franKg
    Sigh.....looks like its time for our daily dose of liberal parnoid delusion, does anyone here not think that in 10 years or so we will be not at all out war with Islamo-fascists?

    Terrorism is not going away and if Al-queda had been around in 1776 then our constitution would've been drastically different that what it presently is

    Yet again its obvious that you people endorse the "turn our backs" strategy to fight terrorism, or to be politcally correct " The struggle against religious freedom fighters"
    Frank, you haven't read a single book like 1984, or Farenheight 451 huh. There is a scary relation to those books and what is happening in this country. We are seeing our rights stripped away, and it's not so much the fact that its Bush doing it, or republicans or democrats. Here's where we have the problem. The problem is simply this, the executive office (which is the president) now has the authority to label anyone they want an unlawful enemy combatant. And there are no checks and balances against those accusations. They basically wiped the constitution with their arse. And if you think that our founding fathers would have designed the constitution differently you are crazy. they had a different kind of oppressive "terrorist" leadership back then. Firm values and ideology is what had them create a constitution that would stand up against Imperialistic terrorist regimes like England. Because England was basically the Islam of that era. Trying to convert everyone to Christianity, taking land and killing indigienous people's on the idea that they were better and deserved it more than they did. So you can agree with this law frank, but when someone get's mad at you and calls the CIA, and they come to your house in the middle of the night. Throw a black bag over your head and hold you in a secret prison. You'll wish you had seen a little more outrage in the beggining...

  12. #12
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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Quote Originally Posted by franKg
    Sigh.....looks like its time for our daily dose of liberal parnoid delusion, does anyone here not think that in 10 years or so we will be not at all out war with Islamo-fascists?

    Terrorism is not going away and if Al-queda had been around in 1776 then our constitution would've been drastically different that what it presently is

    Yet again its obvious that you people endorse the "turn our backs" strategy to fight terrorism, or to be politcally correct " The struggle against religious freedom fighters"
    Who is advocating turning their backs on terrorism Frankie? Maybe if the law didn't allow a loophole for everday american citizens to be locked up you wouldn't hear so much slack from our side of the fence. You really miss the point here Frankie. This law can really be abused by our president. Whether it's Bush or another president down the road, does it help you sleep better at night knowing that your fate could possibly be at the hands of one man and he doesn't have to explain himself to nobody, not even the supreme court.

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    Re: You're under arrest.

    We can't go back to the way it was before 9/11, someday Al-queda is going to make another run at this county and all you people care about is the feds might be listening in on your phone conversations, reading your email, setting up surveillance outside your house, I say let them , I've got nothing to hide and there are certain sacrifices that we as individuals will have to make if we want this country to be safe and I still have not heard exactly what personnal freedoms any of you have lost
    Originally posted by Americanadian
    Palin: Omit the "i" and you're left with "Pain".

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    Re: You're under arrest.

    In my county they have a "Guns for money program"They have done this two years in a row.They say its to keep unwanted guns off the streets.But the guns that they get and the people that they get them from just make me laugh.You have good law abideing citizens digging their shot guns and old hand guns out of their closets and bringing them in.None of these guns would likely have ever been used in a crime.But the people line up for the safty of our comunitys and sell their rights for 50 bucks.I am no gun lover I am a lover of peace.I wish there were no guns or bombs.Im an idealist.I want to go back to the good old days when wars were faught with swords and if you wanted to kill a man you had to look him in the face.But I am also a realist and I realize this will most likely never happen.And this being so and with the state of our govenment all we have is our constitutional rights and that includes the right to bear arms and Im telling you even as a tree huggin peace lovin individual Im gonna get my arms while the gettin is still good and in the spirit of a man I despise C.Heston They can pry it from my cold dead hands!!!
    Last edited by Indie; 10-19-2006 at 11:39 PM.

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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Quote Originally Posted by franKg
    We can't go back to the way it was before 9/11, someday Al-queda is going to make another run at this county and all you people care about is the feds might be listening in on your phone conversations, reading your email, setting up surveillance outside your house, I say let them , I've got nothing to hide and there are certain sacrifices that we as individuals will have to make if we want this country to be safe and I still have not heard exactly what personnal freedoms any of you have lost

    I'm willing to make sacrifices at the airport, at the border, etc. What I don't want to sacrifice is my right to know what I'm being locked up for, the right to counsel (which I see as VERY important being I am in the legal field), the right of my family to know why I got locked up. I don't want a small handfull of people to make those descions that used to be up to a judge and now that they can monitor my email, phone, etc. it's nice to know they could use it against me.

    Wake up Frank. Your liberties have been taken. Just pray that there never comes a time when this law gets used against people like you and me because after all, it's at one or two people's discretion and in the future it won't be Bush and Rumsfield pulling the strings.

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    Re: You're under arrest.

    Frank What the hell are we fighting the terrorists for if our own government is gonna take our freedoms away anyway?

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