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Thread: Religion

  1. #1
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    Religion

    Religion is whats destroying this world.

    Religion should have absolutely NOTHING to do with the government and the decisions it makes..the word GOD shouldnt even be allowed to be mentioned in the whitehouse, or in the pledge of allegiance... the fundamentalist need to be taken OUT OF THE WHITEHOUSE..

    RELIGION SHOULD BE STRICTLY PERSONAL. END OF STORY.


    IMO the world will not start to make REAL progress until todays Religious Ideas/Beliefs are wiped completely off the Earth.


    think about it...


    End of Rant.
    Last edited by stefandozier; 10-06-2006 at 02:05 AM.

  2. 10-06-2006, 01:48 AM


  3. #2
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    Re: Religion

    Sounds familiar. Hmmmm, oh yeah, Hitler, Stalin, Castro, etc etc had similar points of view.
    A giant mushroom cloud, 24 empty missile tubes... It's Miller Time!

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    Re: Religion

    I agree. Mostly. Enough said.

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    Re: Religion

    At face value, no, religion should not be allowed in politics. Morals and compromise should be what is in politics but that is not the way the world goes around.

    I see no problem with the word God being in the white house as it has been there since the inception of our goverment and I don't see the goverment thowing it around to intimidate it's citizens, thus the separation of church and state. I definately believe that kids should be allowed to study the bible in school if they so choose to take a class on it because it is recognized in all major religions and it is a very important history tool. Jesus was a real man (people can debate his origins) but he did walk the earth preaching his message and obviously made a big impact regardless of whether he was the son of God.

    But some cultures have revolved completely around religion, thus the goverment does too.

  6. #5
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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by Button
    At face value, no, religion should not be allowed in politics. Morals and compromise should be what is in politics but that is not the way the world goes around.

    I see no problem with the word God being in the white house as it has been there since the inception of our goverment and I don't see the goverment thowing it around to intimidate it's citizens, thus the separation of church and state. I definately believe that kids should be allowed to study the bible in school if they so choose to take a class on it because it is recognized in all major religions and it is a very important history tool. Jesus was a real man (people can debate his origins) but he did walk the earth preaching his message and obviously made a big impact regardless of whether he was the son of God.

    But some cultures have revolved completely around religion, thus the goverment does too.
    But it seems as if the"separation of the church and state" is becoming less Separate...and NO Students should not be allowed to study the bible in public schools, absolutely not!, give me ONE good reason why you think that??? if they want to study/read the bible they should DO IT ON THEIR ON TIME! AT HOME!, not in a public school...now a university specifically aimed towards religious studies is a different thing, but not in publics schools....As Far as the United States Government goes, are you saying this nation was founded on Christianity? if so, youve been mislead.

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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by stefandozier
    But it seems as if the"separation of the church and state" is becoming less Separate...and NO Students should not be allowed to study the bible in public schools, absolutely not!, give me ONE good reason why you think that???
    Oh...I don't know...

    How about the fact that it's the single most influential piece of literature in human history?

  8. #7
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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by yossarian
    Oh...I don't know...

    How about the fact that it's the single most influential piece of literature in human history?

    If it were to ever be taught in public schools it should be taught as STRICTLY FICTION!..NOT FACT...and students should be given the OPTION as to whether they take the class or not and as far as you saying " its the single most influential piece of literature in human history"... thats just an opinion... I certainly dont think that its the most influential piece of literature in human history...i think its a book of fiction..

    you people in the political world might want to try thinking every now and then, its good for you. humans become more and more like sheeps every day.

  9. #8
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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by stefandozier
    But it seems as if the"separation of the church and state" is becoming less Separate...and NO Students should not be allowed to study the bible in public schools, absolutely not!, give me ONE good reason why you think that??? if they want to study/read the bible they should DO IT ON THEIR ON TIME! AT HOME!, not in a public school...now a university specifically aimed towards religious studies is a different thing, but not in publics schools....As Far as the United States Government goes, are you saying this nation was founded on Christianity? if so, youve been mislead.
    High schools offer special elective credit courses in bible, theology, art, music, agriculture, drama, golf, chess, etc. all the time. These particular things aren't needed per say but the school requires a certain amount of elective courses. What's wrong with offering a class about bible history or a class on different religions? The bible is a historical book and historians have proved that a lot of the historical stuff in the bible actually happened. The bible contains more than just information about God and yes Jesus actually walked the earth. Nobody has to beleive that he was indeed a religious figure but a man named Jesus preached the gospel. I don't see anything wrong with teenagers signing up for those elective courses if they choose to do so just like nobody has to sign up for them if they don't want too.

    I learned the history of religions in school and it was required as I think it should be. Everybody should get a basic understanding of the main religions as part of social studies because its something they will face in real life. Schools shouldn't push a religion but people need to know these things and maybe if they learned the facts they wouldn't become predjiduce against people of a certain religion based on what they've heard.

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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by stefandozier
    If it were to ever be taught in public schools it should be taught as STRICTLY FICTION!..NOT FACT...and students should be given the OPTION as to whether they take the class or not and as far as you saying " its the single most influential piece of literature in human history"... thats just an opinion... I certainly dont think that its the most influential piece of literature in human history...i think its a book of fiction..
    I would say it is the or one of the most influential pieces of literature in human history. Literature often times is fiction. And like I said earlier, many parts of the bible are fact, it's a history lesson.

  11. #10
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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by Button
    many parts of the bible are fact, it's a history lesson.

    Care to show some evidence? lets see it.

  12. #11
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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by stefandozier
    Care to show some evidence? lets see it.
    History of the Bible. Did ancient historians also write about Jesus?

    Yes. Cornelius Tacitus (A.D. 55-120), an historian of first-century Rome, "is considered one of the most accurate historians of the ancient world."2 An excerpt from Tacitus tells us that Nero "inflicted the most exquisite tortures on a class...called Christians. ...Christus [Christ], from whom the name had its origin, suffered the extreme penalty during the reign of Tiberius at the hands of one of our procurators, Pontius Pilatus...."3 (In contrast, the Muslim Quran, written six centuries after Jesus lived, reports that Jesus was never crucified, though it is a fact confirmed by numerous secular historians.4)

    Flavius Josephus, a Jewish historian (A.D. 38-100+), wrote about Jesus in his Jewish Antiquities. From Josephus, "we learn that Jesus was a wise man who did surprising feats, taught many, won over followers from among Jews and Greeks, was believed to be the Messiah, was accused by the Jewish leaders, was condemned to be crucified by Pilate, and was considered to be resurrected."5

    Suetonius, Pliny the Younger, and Thallus also wrote about Christian worship and persecution that is concurrent with New Testament accounts.

    Even the Jewish Talmud, again not a favourable source regarding Jesus, concurs about the major events of his life. From the Talmud, "we learn that Jesus was conceived out of wedlock, gathered disciples, made blasphemous claims about himself, and worked miracles, but these miracles are attributed to sorcery and not to God."6

    This is remarkable information considering that most ancient historians focused on political and military leaders. Yet ancient Jews, Greeks and Romans (who themselves were not ardent followers of Jesus) substantiate the major events that are presented in the four Gospels.

    Does archaeology support the New Testament?

    Archaeology cannot prove that the Bible is God's written Word to us. However, archaeology can (and does) substantiate the Bible's historical accuracy. Archaeologists have consistently discovered the names of government officials, kings, cities, and festivals mentioned in the Bible--sometimes when historians didn't think such people or places existed. For example, the Gospel of John tells of Jesus healing a cripple next to the Pool of Bethesda. The text even describes the five porticoes (walkways) leading to the pool. Scholars didn't think the pool even existed, until archaeologists found it forty feet below ground, complete with the five porticoes.10 The Bible has a tremendous amount of historical detail, so not everything mentioned in it has been found through archaeology. However, not one archaeological find has conflicted with what the Bible records.11

    In contrast, news reporter Lee Strobel comments about the Book of Mormon: "Archaeology has repeatedly failed to substantiate its claims about events that supposedly occurred long ago in the Americas. I remember writing to the Smithsonian Institute to inquire about whether there was any evidence supporting the claims of Mormonism, only to be told in unequivocal terms that its archaeologists see 'no direct connection between the archaeology of the New World and the subject matter of the book.'" Archaeologists have never located cities, persons, names, or places mentioned in the Book of Mormon.12

    By comparison, many of the ancient locations mentioned by Luke, in the Book of Acts in the New Testament, have been identified through archaeology. "In all, Luke names thirty-two countries, fifty-four cities and nine islands without an error."13

    Archaeology has also refuted many ill-founded theories about the Bible. For example, still taught in some colleges today, the JEPD Documentary Hypothesis suggests that Moses could not have written the Pentateuch (the first five books of the Bible), because writing was non-existent in his day. Then archaeologists discovered the Black Stele. "It had wedge-shaped characters on it and contained the detailed laws of Hammurrabi. Was it post-Moses? No! It was pre-Mosaic; not only that, but it was pre-Abraham (2,000 B.C.). It preceded Moses' writings by at least three centuries....The 'Documentary Hypothesis' is still taught, yet its original basis has been eradicated and shown to be false."14

    Another major archaeological find confirmed an early alphabet in the discovery of the Ebla Tablets in northern Syria in 1974. These 14,000 clay tablets are thought to be from about 2300 B.C., which is hundreds of years before Abraham.15 The tablets describe culture and life in similar ways to what is recorded in Genesis chapters 12-50.

    Archaeology consistently and strongly confirms the historical accuracy of the Bible.

    Notes:
    {2} McDowell, Josh. The New Evidence that Demands a Verdict (Thomas Nelson Publishers, 1999), p. 55.
    {3} Tacitus, A. 15.44.
    {4} Comments from Dr. William Lane Craig, delivered to a college audience in December, 2001: "From the pages of the Jewish historian Josephus we learn that Jesus was executed by Roman authority under Pontius Pilate by means of crucifixion. And according to Tacitus, the Roman historian, he also names Pontius Pilate as the one responsible for Jesus' execution by crucifixion. According to both Josephus and a Syrian writer, Mara Bar-Serapion, the Jewish authorities participated in the events leading up to Jesus' execution, and they justified this as a proper undertaking against a heretic. So in extra biblical sources, Jewish and Roman, we have evidence for the trial of Jesus, the involvement of both the Jewish authorities as well as the Roman authorities, the mode of his execution, namely by crucifixion. And these facts are fixed so firmly as an anchor point in history no historical scholar, no historian denies these. On the contrary, they are so firmly fixed they actually become a criterion of authenticity."
    {5} Wilkins, Michael J. & Moreland, J.P. Jesus Under Fire (Zondervan Publishing House, 1995), p. 40.
    {6} Ibid.
    {10} Strobel, p. 132.
    {11} The renowned Jewish archaeologist, Nelson Glueck, wrote: "It may be stated categorically that no archaeological discovery has ever controverted a biblical reference." cited by McDowell, Josh. The New Evidence That Demands a Verdict (Thomas Nelson Publishers, 1999), p. 61.
    {12} Strobel, p. 143-144.
    {13} Geisler, Norman L. Baker Encyclopedia of Christian Apologetics (Grand Rapids: Baker, 1998).
    {14} McDowell, Josh. Evidence That Demands a Verdict (1972), p. 19.
    {15} http://english.sdaglobal.org/story/a...ecret/ebla.htm
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  13. #12
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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by yossarian
    Oh...I don't know...

    How about the fact that it's the single most influential piece of literature in human history?
    So what? Our (US Constituion) provides every the right to worship as they please but, it also protects us from those who would force their religious views on others.

    It's not a popularity contest that determines what out Constitution guarantees.

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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by SynikReturns
    So what? Our (US Constituion) provides every the right to worship as they please but, it also protects us from those who would force their religious views on others.

    It's not a popularity contest that determines what out Constitution guarantees.
    Your Constitution is being taken away from you, bit by bit.
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  15. #14
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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by SynikReturns
    So what? Our (US Constituion) provides every the right to worship as they please but, it also protects us from those who would force their religious views on others.

    It's not a popularity contest that determines what out Constitution guarantees.

    I agree. My statement didn't really represent my stance on church and state. Rather, I was playing devil's advocate to the previous poster's blanket comment regarding the Bible. A comment which, along with the majority of his irrational rants, wasn't very well thought out.

    I didn't say I think the Bible should be forced on kids in school, and I'm completely in favor of separation of church and state. Check my posting history. I actually started a thread on the Treaty of Tripoli, which proves the fact that the framers of the Constitution did not found the United States on Christianity, as is the claim of fundamentalist evangelicals.

    However, prohibiting students from reading the Bible while at school is without question, in my opinion, a state infringement on freedom of religion. We should be careful not to kill the root to grow the tree.
    Last edited by yossarian; 10-07-2006 at 06:15 PM.

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    Re: Religion

    Quote Originally Posted by stefandozier
    If it were to ever be taught in public schools it should be taught as STRICTLY FICTION!..NOT FACT...and students should be given the OPTION as to whether they take the class or not and as far as you saying " its the single most influential piece of literature in human history"... thats just an opinion... I certainly dont think that its the most influential piece of literature in human history...i think its a book of fiction..

    you people in the political world might want to try thinking every now and then, its good for you. humans become more and more like sheeps every day.
    if your gonna use the word sheeps!?be aware that sheeps can't change their nature!?and any farmer can tell you the DIFFERENCE between sheeps and goats!?so you are saying the idea that the world should believe in the nature of sheeps or goats,and you pick goats!?cause sheeps go to the slaughter!?until the odds change!?and you are NOT the rock the boat type!?hehe!!just askin....

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    Re: Religion

    Sheeps and goats are the same thing to me.....delicious. Never did like referring to people as a flock. Sheep and goats get sheered and eaten regularly. Do you really think those shepards were.....vegetarian?

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