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  1. #1
    Lord_jag's Avatar
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    Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Why the Christian God is Impossible
    by Chad Docterman
    Introduction

    Christians consider the existence of their God to be an obvious truth that no sane man could deny. I strongly disagree with this assumption not only because evidence for the existence of this presumably ubiquitous yet invisible God is lacking, but because the very nature Christians attribute to this God is self-contradictory.

    Proving a Universal Negative

    It is taken for granted by Christians, as well as many atheists, that a universal negative cannot be proven. In this case, that universal negative is the statement that the Christian God does not exist. One would have to have omniscience, they say, in order to prove that anything does not exist. I disagree with this position, however, because omniscience is not needed in order to prove that a thing whose nature is a self-contradiction cannot, and therefore does not exist.

    I do not need a complete knowledge of the universe to prove to you that cubic spheres do not exist. Such objects have mutually-exclusive attributes which would render their existence impossible. For example, a cube, by definition, has 8 corners, while a sphere has none. These properties are completely incompatible: they cannot be held simultaneously by the same object. It is my intent to show that the supposed properties of the Christian God Yahweh, like those of a cubic sphere, are incompatible, and by so doing, to show Yahweh's existence to be an impossibility.


    Defining YHWH

    Before we can discuss the existence of a thing, we must define it. Christians have endowed their God with all of the following attributes: He is eternal, all-powerful, and created everything. He created all the laws of nature and can change anything by an act of will. He is all-good, all-loving, and perfectly just. He is a personal God who experiences all of the emotions a human does. He is all-knowing. He sees everything past and future.

    God's creation was originally perfect, but humans, by disobeying him, brought imperfection into the world. Humans are evil and sinful, and must suffer in this world because of their sinfulness. God gives humans the opportunity to accept forgiveness for their sin, and all who do will be rewarded with eternal bliss in heaven, but while they are on earth, they must suffer for his sake. All humans who choose not to accept this forgiveness must go to hell and be tormented for eternity.


    Perfection Seeks Even More Perfection
    What did God do during that eternity before he created everything? If God was all that existed back then, what disturbed the eternal equilibrium and compelled him to create? Was he bored? Was he lonely? God is supposed to be perfect. If something is perfect, it is complete--it needs nothing else. We humans engage in activities because we are pursuing that elusive perfection, because there is disequilibrium caused by a difference between what we are and what we want to be. If God is perfect, there can be no disequilibrium. There is nothing he needs, nothing he desires, and nothing he must or will do. A God who is perfect does nothing except exist. A perfect creator God is impossible.

    Perfection Begets Imperfection

    But, for the sake of argument, let's continue. Let us suppose that this perfect God did create the universe. Humans were the crown of his creation, since they were created in God's image and have the ability to make decisions. However, these humans spoiled the original perfection by choosing to disobey God.

    What!? If something is perfect, nothing imperfect can come from it. Someone once said that bad fruit cannot come from a good tree, and yet this "perfect" God created a "perfect" universe which was rendered imperfect by the "perfect" humans. The ultimate source of imperfection is God. What is perfect cannot become imperfect, so humans must have been created imperfect. What is perfect cannot create anything imperfect, so God must be imperfect to have created these imperfect humans. A perfect God who creates imperfect humans is impossible.

    The Freewill Argument

    The Christians' objection to this argument involves freewill. They say that a being must have freewill to be happy. The omnibenevolent God did not wish to create robots, so he gave humans freewill to enable them to experience love and happiness. But the humans used this freewill to choose evil, and introduced imperfection into God's originally perfect universe. God had no control over this decision, so the blame for our imperfect universe is on the humans, not God.

    Here is why the argument is weak. First, if God is omnipotent, then the assumption that freewill is necessary for happiness is false. If God could make it a rule that only beings with freewill may experience happiness, then he could just as easily have made it a rule that only robots may experience happiness. The latter option is clearly superior, since perfect robots will never make decisions which could render them or their creator unhappy, whereas beings with freewill could. A perfect and omnipotent God who creates beings capable of ruining their own happiness is impossible.

    Second, even if we were to allow the necessity of freewill for happiness, God could have created humans with freewill who did not have the ability to choose evil, but to choose between several good options.

    Third, God supposedly has freewill, and yet he does not make imperfect decisions. If humans are miniature images of God, our decisions should likewise be perfect. Also, the occupants of heaven, who presumably must have freewill to be happy, will never use that freewill to make imperfect decisions. Why would the originally perfect humans do differently?
    The point remains: the presence of imperfections in the universe disproves the supposed perfection of its creator.

    Belief More Important Than Action

    Consider all of the people who live in the remote regions of the world who have never even heard the "gospel" of Jesus Christ. Consider the people who have naturally adhered to the religion of their parents and nation as they had been taught to do since birth. If we are to believe the Christians, all of these people will perish in the eternal fire for not believing in Jesus. It does not matter how just, kind, and generous they have been with their fellow humans during their lifetime: if they do not accept the gospel of Jesus, they are condemned. No just God would ever judge a man by his beliefs rather than his actions.

    Contradictory Justice

    One need look to no source other than the Bible to discover its imperfections, for it contradicts itself and thus exposes its own imperfection. It contradicts itself on matters of justice, for the same just God who assures his people that sons shall not be punished for the sins of their fathers turns around and destroys an entire household for the sin of one man (he had stolen some of Yahweh's war loot). It was this same Yahweh who afflicted thousands of his innocent people with plague and death to punish their evil king David for taking a census (?!). It was this same Yahweh who allowed the humans to slaughter his son because the perfect Yahweh had botched his own creation. Consider how many have been stoned, burned, slaughtered, raped, and enslaved because of Yahweh's skewed sense of justice. The blood of innocent babies is on the perfect, just, compassionate hands of Yahweh.
    Contradictory History

    The Bible contradicts itself on matters of history. A person who reads and compares the contents of the Bible will be confused about exactly who Esau's wives were, whether Timnah was a concubine or a son, and whether Jesus' earthly lineage is through Solomon or his brother Nathan. These are but a few of hundreds of documented historical contradictions. If the Bible cannot confirm itself in mundane earthly matters, how are we to trust it on moral and spiritual matters?

    Unfulfilled Prophecy

    The Bible misinterprets its own prophecies. Read Isaiah 7 and compare it to Matthew 1 to find but one of many misinterpreted prophecies of which Christians are either passively or willfully ignorant. The fulfillment of prophecy in the Bible is cited as proof of its divine inspiration, and yet here is but one major example of a prophecy whose intended meaning has been and continues to be twisted to support subsequent absurd and false doctrines. There are no ends to which the credulous will not go to support their feeble beliefs in the face of compelling evidence against them.

    The Bible is imperfect. It only takes one imperfection to destroy the supposed perfection of this alleged Word of God. Many have been found. A perfect God who reveals his perfect will in an imperfect book is impossible.

    The Omniscient Changes the Future

    A God who knows the future is powerless to change it. An omniscient God who is all-powerful and freewilled is impossible.

    The Conclusion of the matter

    I have offered arguments for the impossibility, and thus the non- existence, of the Christian God Yahweh. No reasonable and freethinking individual can accept the existence of a being whose nature is so contradictory as that of Yahweh, the "perfect" creator of our imperfect universe. The existence of Yahweh is as impossible as the existence of cubic spheres or invisible pink unicorns.

  2. #2
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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    You are proving it only to yourself. Religion is based on belief and trust, not logic. No religion is logical.

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    Lord_jag is offline I am God because I say I am. Prove me wrong.
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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Yes, Some people just cannot listen to reason. Some people are perfectly content to walk around telling everyone that the sky is green and grass is blue. Even when you show them grass and point out the sky they just remain blissfully ignorant of the truth and feel sorry for you for not agreeing with them that the sky is green and grass is blue.

    Perhaps someday you will take the time to look around and notice that the sky is blue. It is undeniably blue every time you look at it. Perhaps when you discover the truth and remove the haze that clouds your ability to look at facts you will learn that your blissfulness is based on ignorance.

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Proving a Universal Negative

    It is taken for granted by Christians, as well as many atheists, that a universal negative cannot be proven. In this case, that universal negative is the statement that the Christian God does not exist. One would have to have omniscience, they say, in order to prove that anything does not exist. I disagree with this position, however, because omniscience is not needed in order to prove that a thing whose nature is a self-contradiction cannot, and therefore does not exist.

    I do not need a complete knowledge of the universe to prove to you that cubic spheres do not exist. Such objects have mutually-exclusive attributes which would render their existence impossible. For example, a cube, by definition, has 8 corners, while a sphere has none. These properties are completely incompatible: they cannot be held simultaneously by the same object. It is my intent to show that the supposed properties of the Christian God Yahweh, like those of a cubic sphere, are incompatible, and by so doing, to show Yahweh's existence to be an impossibility.

    Arguing the scientific impossibility of something spiritual, which is, by its very definition, outside the scientific realm, is a waste of time and largely irrelevant. It seems this blatantly obvious fact has somehow escaped the author's attention.

    Human logic is one of the most overrated forces in the universe. This article, in all its intellectual haughtiness, merely adds to the already towering pile of volumes illustrating the incomparable hubris of man.

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Human logic is one of the most overrated forces in the universe
    The other being God

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    No religion is logical
    He is right, so therfore no logical thinking person should belive any religion

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Quote Originally Posted by wazzaa
    The other being God
    So you do, in fact, acknowledge His existence. ;)


    Quote Originally Posted by wazzaa
    He is right, so therfore no logical thinking person should belive any religion.
    Not quite. For one to believe in God, he or she must first accept the limitations of human logic.

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord_jag
    Yes, Some people just cannot listen to reason. Some people are perfectly content to walk around telling everyone that the sky is green and grass is blue. Even when you show them grass and point out the sky they just remain blissfully ignorant of the truth and feel sorry for you for not agreeing with them that the sky is green and grass is blue.

    Perhaps someday you will take the time to look around and notice that the sky is blue. It is undeniably blue every time you look at it. Perhaps when you discover the truth and remove the haze that clouds your ability to look at facts you will learn that your blissfulness is based on ignorance.
    I believe that the sky being blue is an illusion caused by the way sunlight is bounced around our atmosphere and the gaseous components of our atmosphere or some such thing. So in actuality the sky is not really blue but only appears to be blue.
    At times the sky appears to be red, yellow, orange or even a purple or any combination there of, when the sun is setting. Again an illusion caused by the sunlight and the components in the atmosphere.

    A color blind person would have trouble agreeing with you on the green grass issue also.

  9. #9
    Lord_jag's Avatar
    Lord_jag is offline I am God because I say I am. Prove me wrong.
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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Quote Originally Posted by Anti_thesisofreason
    I believe that the sky being blue is an illusion caused by the way sunlight is bounced around our atmosphere and the gaseous components of our atmosphere or some such thing. So in actuality the sky is not really blue but only appears to be blue.
    At times the sky appears to be red, yellow, orange or even a purple or any combination there of, when the sun is setting. Again an illusion caused by the sunlight and the components in the atmosphere.

    A color blind person would have trouble agreeing with you on the green grass issue also.
    yes, yes, but for that matter color doesn't really exist. You can look at a red ball and call it red, but it is not red. It aborbs all colors except red. Radiation with a frequency of 700 nanometers will bouce off this object that your eyes translate into an electrical impule. Your brain sees this impulse and triggers memories of other objects that had the same signal. Your brain has been conditioned to respond "red" whenever you see that signal. The object itself is not red. It just reflects red.

    To a being with an eye that is not contrained to our visual limits of radiation of 400 to 700 nanometers the world might look completely different. Condsider if someone could only see Xrays and could not see things in our visual spectrum. It would look similar to the vision of "Predator"

    Now then. Instead of arguing the science of my example, how about if you tell me how you can believe in a God when it is impossible due to so many factors. Perhaps you can show me a cubic sphere?

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord_jag
    Now then. Instead of arguing the science of my example, how about if you tell me how you can believe in a God when it is impossible due to so many factors. Perhaps you can show me a cubic sphere?

    I never said that I believed in the Christian god. Your article explicitly points towards discrepincies within the realm of the Christian god.

    However, that does not mean that I do not believe in a “god” – for lack of a better word. I can just as easily believe in a supreme deity of some sort without resorting to the support of a failable object such as the bible. Such a source can be too easily manipulated to the desires of those who wish to have control over others.


    I think Thomas Paine said it best.

    “Human language is local and changeable, and is therefore incapable of being used as the means of unchangeable and universal information.”
    -The Age of Reason-

    “but human language, more especially as there is not an universal language, is incapable of being used as an universal means of unchangeable and uniform information; and therefore it is not the means that God useth in manifesting himself universally to man.”
    -The Age of Reason-

    Would your cubic sphere be possible elsewhere, on another plane of exsistence or another dimension?

    Could it be possible here? Probably not since the consensus of its non-exsistence is greater than the consensus of its exsistence (at this point in time).

    But then again if there is any remote possibility of it occuring then there is a chance (though most likely very small) of the aforementioned cubric spheres exsistence. Your mind conceived it thus the possibility of it being true, no matter how small (the possibility, not your brain – no offence intended) is still there.

    But then I digress, we are talking logic and not statistics.

  11. #11
    TheWorker Guest

    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    god schmod, im gonna drink 10 beers, smoke 5 ciggerettes, watch some porn, and go to sleep.

    is that ok with the believers and the non believers??

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Quote Originally Posted by TheWorker
    god schmod, im gonna drink 10 beers, smoke 5 ciggerettes, watch some porn, and go to sleep.

    is that ok with the believers and the non believers??
    That's why there is freewill == choose your path-- but there
    will be consequences sooner or later...

    I sure hope you have more pasttimes then those>

    BTL

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Quote Originally Posted by bethelight
    That's why there is freewill == choose your path-- but there
    will be consequences sooner or later...

    I sure hope you have more pasttimes then those>

    BTL
    Whats wrong with beer and smokes and porn? Not hurting anyone.... unless that child porn... then YOU SICK BASTARD!

    but if its not, He's not hurting anyone... live and let live right?

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Quote Originally Posted by Lord_jag
    Whats wrong with beer and smokes and porn? Not hurting anyone.... unless that child porn... then YOU SICK BASTARD!

    but if its not, He's not hurting anyone... live and let live right?

    WEll i would say you are probably hurting someone with
    your actions- ie smoking reduces life expectancy...
    thereby shortening your life to be around the ones that love you.. will they not miss you?? And again nothing wrong with drinking - but excess is another issue .. and i am not sure you fit into that category.
    And as for porn... if you are sitting watching it -- with say kids in the house - what message are you sending out? What about your wife or girlfriend -- how do they feel about you watching porn.
    (Actions speak louder than words..)

    Anyways - what i have just said was purely judgemental..sorry...
    and for the most part .... what you do in the privacy of your own home.. and intentionally not hurting anyone is fine ... but i think the long term effects of what you do - maybe should be considered.

    You are exercising your free will ... and it is not effecting to me..
    so i have no specific problem with it.

    BTL
    Last edited by bethelight; 09-15-2006 at 09:43 PM.

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Quote Originally Posted by TheWorker
    god schmod, im gonna drink 10 beers, smoke 5 ciggerettes, watch some porn, and go to sleep.

    is that ok with the believers and the non believers??
    i cant speak for everyone,but in my case,ONLY if you SHARE!?hehe!!just askin....

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    Re: Why God is impossible - an Essay

    Quote Originally Posted by borisf96
    You are proving it only to yourself. Religion is based on belief and trust, not logic. No religion is logical.
    then why do MOST religious CLAIMANTS!?seek to USE logic to defend their FAITH!?or their STUFF!?(the JOB problem!?)hehe!?just askin....

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