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  1. #1
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    americaspower.org

    http://www.americaspower.org/
    Last edited by mumbles; 09-13-2011 at 04:54 AM.

  2. #2
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    Re: americaspower.org

    Creating new threads containing just a link should be frowned upon, here on the interwebs. Maybe theres a word for that?

    Let me think ... it'll come to me in a minute ...

  3. #3
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    Re: americaspower.org

    I really don't like spammers. I wish the mods could do something about it.

    oh wait. Mumbles could you ban yourself for spamming and trolling threads? or at least give yourself a warning.

    Thankyou

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    Re: americaspower.org

    Quote Originally Posted by Spector567 View Post
    I really don't like spammers. I wish the mods could do something about it.

    oh wait. Mumbles could you ban yourself for spamming and trolling threads? or at least give yourself a warning.

    Thankyou
    Wouldn't that be nice!
    A real, honest, falsifiable claim made b.y Seer of dreams:(2011)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cnance View Post
    I believe there will be a nuclear war in October of this year.
    Oh Cnance.... Full of shit as always.

  5. #5
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    Re: americaspower.org

    the content in on that site. if you can't go there and read it you won't be able to understand if i copy and paste all of it here, either.

    we don't have any money to buy chinese made wind turbines, but we are buying them anyway. so it's either insanity or a very crooked deal. we do have lots of coal, and according to this site, there is technology to use it without poluting the air. even co2 can be captured, even though i don't believe co2 is dangerous.

    clean coal. can scientists find ways to use coal in a clean way that's still costs less than windmills?
    Last edited by mumbles; 09-13-2011 at 04:55 AM.

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    Re: americaspower.org

    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    the content in on that site. if you can't go there and read it you won't be able to understand if i copy and paste all of it here, either.

    we don't have any money to buy chinese made wind turbines, but we are buying them anyway. so it's either insanity or a very crooked deal. we do have lots of coal, and according to this site, there is technology to use it without poluting the air. even co2 can be captured, even though i don't believe co2 is dangerous.

    clean coal. can scientists find ways to use coal in a clean way that's still costs less than windmills?
    How about if you don't just copy and paste the internet onto your forum to begin with?

    Sure. Clean coal. That is a good idea. And a coal burning power plant is a lot cheaper to build than the same capacity of wind generators.

    But... You are forgetting the part of getting the coal. That is expensive and dangerous. I'll even grant you that the total cost of getting the coal and running it in the power plant may be cheaper, but what are the lives of the workers worth? How do you factor in the cost of loss of life and livelihood of the people who have lost their lives or limbs? What about the people with breathing problems from mine-work. Or the explosions.

    Mining coal is dangerous and dirty work, and there's only so much coal. What happens when the coal near a major industrial center runs out?

    And going to china for the turbines? I don't know how you are doing it down there, but here in Canada we made our own turbine plant. It would probably be cheaper to get them from China. No one in North America will work for the pennies per hour that they do. You get a large percentage of your goods from China. Why does this one thing bother you?

    You don't have money not to buy into renewable ******.
    A real, honest, falsifiable claim made b.y Seer of dreams:(2011)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cnance View Post
    I believe there will be a nuclear war in October of this year.
    Oh Cnance.... Full of shit as always.

  7. #7
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    Re: americaspower.org

    of course we want miners to be safer and that can be done. we own coal, it's here, does not require transfer of wealth to another country. all of it is made here, workers paid here, taxed here. windmills from china benefits only chinese workers and chinese capitalist companies like general electric. GE actually bragged that they got US government money to build windmill factories in china. that's just sick. americans out of work, can't pay the electric bill, but the money they already paid in taxes is given to GE and china.

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    Re: americaspower.org

    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    of course we want miners to be safer and that can be done. we own coal, it's here, does not require transfer of wealth to another country.
    How much coal? How long will that last? 100 years? 1000? Then what?
    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    all of it is made here, workers paid here, taxed here. windmills from china benefits only chinese workers and chinese capitalist companies like general electric.
    And.... it benefits Americans too. The Chinese can't maintain them. They can't monitor the outputs and make sure the infrastructure is in place and maintained. American's have to do all that.
    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    GE actually bragged that they got US government money to build windmill factories in china. that's just sick. americans out of work, can't pay the electric bill, but the money they already paid in taxes is given to GE and china.
    So... Your beef is not that windmills are being made, it's that they are being made in China and delivered to the USA for pennies on the dollar for what Americans would want to make them... Is that right?

    So.... Why are windmills suddenly so important? I could list you a thousand goods made in China that Americans could have made instead at 10x the price. Why don't you complain about any of those? Why do you pick wind turbines as your example to fight that fight?

    Why not gas guzzling cars? Or how about the oil freighters? Or maybe 99% of your raw materials for making just about anything? Why stand in the way of something that might actually help the future of North America?
    A real, honest, falsifiable claim made b.y Seer of dreams:(2011)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cnance View Post
    I believe there will be a nuclear war in October of this year.
    Oh Cnance.... Full of shit as always.

  9. #9
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    Re: americaspower.org

    nobody is claiming we can't eat food that we grow here, but they are claiming that we can't use the electricity from coal mined here. we have to buy expensive stuff from overseas, instead. i say, it's all bullshit, the promoters are in for their own gain.

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    Re: americaspower.org

    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    nobody is claiming we can't eat food that we grow here, but they are claiming that we can't use the electricity from coal mined here. we have to buy expensive stuff from overseas, instead. i say, it's all bullshit, the promoters are in for their own gain.
    Than why didn't you say that in the first place??? Instead of going of half cocked about windmills and other random stuff.

    If you stuck to your actual argument you'd find people might actually agree with you.

  11. #11
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    Re: americaspower.org

    The site you linked to is paid for by the US coal industry, so it's hardly surprising that it promotes... wait... let's guess... the US coal industry!

    Clean coal technology is nothing new. I was doing business with a company develping such technology almost 20 years ago.

    The problem at that time was cost. The technology is costly and the energy prices at that time was not high enough to cover the cost of production. Today, it's probably different.

    The problem with coal is the mining and the transportation. Costly and energy consuming. Then we of course have the problem it shares with oil: It's a finite resource. It will end.
    Building yourself into a heavy dependency on coal is just as stupid as doing it with oil.

    I found these figures on total production costs for various energy sources:



    If you're looking at clean coal technology, it doesn't look that cheap really.

    It's much more expensive than hydro power, but that's not surprising.

    What is surprising is that it's 40% more expensive than land based wind power. Given the fact that wind is an infinite resource, it strikes me as a pretty good alternative. I'm pretty sure production prices will go down for wind as the technology evolves. While production prices for coal power will go up as mining becomes more expensive when resources gets empty. Just as the case is with oil.

    I'm well aware that wind can never provide all the energy we need. The trick now is to find something else than oil and coal to bridge the gap until fusion power becomes commercially viable. I think the best answer to that is a combination of nuclear power and various new, renewable sources.

    But, by all means, use the coal you have. Responsibly.

  12. #12
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    Re: americaspower.org

    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    nobody is claiming we can't eat food that we grow here, but they are claiming that we can't use the electricity from coal mined here.
    Who are "they"?

    You use electricity from coal mined in NA all the time.
    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    we have to buy expensive stuff from overseas, instead. i say, it's all bullshit, the promoters are in for their own gain.
    Turbines from overseas are far cheaper than turbines built in America. Private companies do things as cheaply as possible to maximize profits. That's capitalism.

    Conversely, the government could make it's own turbine producing company, hire Americans, install them and provide power for sale to the American public. That's socialism.


    I don't get it. Are you comparing mining coal here to buying coal from overseas, mining coal here to buying turbines overseas or building turbines here to buying turbines overseas?
    A real, honest, falsifiable claim made b.y Seer of dreams:(2011)
    Quote Originally Posted by Cnance View Post
    I believe there will be a nuclear war in October of this year.
    Oh Cnance.... Full of shit as always.

  13. #13
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    Re: americaspower.org

    Quote Originally Posted by thistle View Post
    Creating new threads containing just a link should be frowned upon, here on the interwebs. Maybe theres a word for that?

    Let me think ... it'll come to me in a minute ...
    How about "laziness" or "he doesn't understand it himself," or "he is afraid to state his opinion or interpretation because it might by swiftly shot down?":freak3:

  14. #14
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    Re: americaspower.org

    um. you have nothing to say on the topic of clean coal, but have lots to say about me, somebody you don't know?

    we have coal. we can't produce windmills and have to buy them from our enemy, communist china. when i was young, everybody would have recognized that as insanity, but now, it passes for wisdom.

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    Re: americaspower.org

    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    um. you have nothing to say on the topic of clean coal, but have lots to say about me, somebody you don't know?

    we have coal. we can't produce windmills and have to buy them from our enemy, communist china. when i was young, everybody would have recognized that as insanity, but now, it passes for wisdom.
    Is THAT what your link was about? Wow. Should have mentioned that. Problem is, everyone knows you as a useless spammer, so they ignore your link spam.

    Grow up, and people might engage you in conversation.

  16. #16
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    Re: americaspower.org

    idiot, the title of the site is america's power, so you thought it was an ad about athlete's foot or tampax? really, just shut the beep up. you haven't had anything to say about any subject/topic since you've been here.
    Last edited by mumbles; 11-11-2013 at 06:50 PM.

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