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Thread: Susan Kozma

  1. #1
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    Susan Kozma

    A holocaust survivor talks about Israel's atrocities in the Middle East




    Susan Kozma witnessed one of history's largest genocidal attempts. But having seen and lived through the terror of the holocaust, she hopes that no one would ever have to go through that torment ever again. Unfortunately though, she does not think it is over yet and history continues to be repeated-in Rwanda and in a different way, in Israel as well.

    "The holocaust was a terrible thing, but it is not a reason for me to behave the same way," she said.

    Kozma was sent to a concentration camp at the age of 18, but was lucky enough to leave alive a year later. Her parents and siblings did not survive the holocaust, and she lost 34 members to the massacre. But she said having lived through the holocaust, she does not understand how any Jew would do the same to anyone else.

    "If the Israeli government let everyone live in peace, then the danger that both sides feel in their life would not be there...You can't make peace with arms," she said.

    Kozma, 82, is a Hungarian immigrant to Canada and has spent more than 30 years here, but as she looks outward into the situation in the Middle East, she feels nothing but sorrow.


    She said she understands the reason for the establishment of a Jewish state, but does not understand the reason to implement unequal and discriminatory policies in the state-dividing two nations, Jews and Arabs that lived together in peace for centuries.

    "As a Jew, I know that Israel was established on the one hand because Europe was very guilty since no body did anything to stop the holocaust and the other thing is that Europe was happy to get rid of as many Jews as possible," she explained.

    Kozma said the instability in the Middle East is due to the detrimental mentality that the early leaders of the Israeli state, including the British who helped establish the state, held during that time. She said the view among both was that the Arabs were not a problem in the equation and that they did not count or even exist. She said this mentality and rejection has led to the sorrowful situation in the Middle East and explains the expanding phenomenon of violence in the region--which now threatens to spread its wings into Iran and Syria.

    "It is horrible to reject a nation that has been living there for centuries, just as long as the Jews have lived there. But now to go back 60 years, that is like thinking ' what would it have been like if my family would not have been killed'? It is over now-that time is passed. But they have to try to pick up the threads now and find a solution."

    Kozma described Israel as a state that is no less of a terrorist than how it views Hezbollah and Hamas. She said Hezbollah is not a "terrorist organization," but instead is a social organization in the region, helping the refugees from Palestine in Lebanon as well as the Lebanese Shi'ia population in the south.

    She said hatred and adolescence is the reason for the daily violence in Israel. But she said that if there was no killing of the Arabs, then there would not be any suicide bombings or other attacks. She said these bombings are a reaction from the population that has been treated so poorly by the Jewish population.

    "To understand the violence by the Palestinians is one thing, but to justify it is another. I am a pacifist, so I don't like violence at any cost. But people are very angry there and they have a reason to be," she explained.

    She said that the sentiment among most Jews in Israel is that Arabs are not people and that they need not bother with them.

    "A homeland is important for the Jewish people, but I feel that what Israel is doing is digging their own grave and the existence of Israel can't be based on what they are doing to the Palestinians...Israel can defend itself, but it does not have to kill others and demolish houses in order to do that. That is not self-defense," she said.

    Kozma, also a Canadian, found herself troubled with the way the current prime minister, Stephen Harper has stationed himself in the global arena. In her words, he has "no humanity."

    "His whole attitude is horrible, and I know Canada as a peacekeeping force and Canada has always been balanced in its views, but now that is gone with this new prime minister.... Harper is not stupid unfortunately, he just has no morality, you can see it in his eyes...he has empty eyes," she said.

    But Kozma said one of the several reasons why Harper and the rest of the West is now in support of the state of Israel and continues to ignore its atrocities against the Arabs is due to guilt. She said it is the guilt that the Europeans have for not stopping the holocaust, and on the part of the U.S. there is the guilt of not getting involved soon enough as well as not allowing ships of Jews to land in their country. This, she said, has led to unconditional support for Israel. In sum, the West she said, which views itself as the pioneer of human rights, does not want to risk being called anti-Semitic by the Jewish people, who believe that when they were persecuted, Europe nor the U.S. did enough to stop it.

    But Kozma said regardless of the holocaust, its occurence does not justify doing the same to anyone else, and the international community should stop history from being repeated once again.

    "Whether you are shot dead or you are killed in a concentration camp, the end result is the same. You are dead. There is no difference between the two."


    http://terrorism.suite101.com/articl...raeli__terror_



    *So - What does that make her then, my little Zion pals? Is she a liberal? Or a Nazi? Or just someone better placed than ALL of us, to write this?*
    Every Saint has a past, every sinner has a future..

  2. #2
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    that's an interesting personal opinion by someone who has seen what happens when you deliberately segregate!? :freak3: :judges: :
    i do not endorse/recommend any advertising on scam.com associated with my name /posts or otherwise. thank you

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    Re: Susan Kozma

    I would be especially interested to hear the thoughts of Petey, and Grim, over this one.

    Would be nice to see how they can respond to this, while having to, at the same time, ensure that they do not offend Ms Kozma.

    I'll check back later - see if they have added...
    Every Saint has a past, every sinner has a future..

  4. #4
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Interesting.

    Nothing yet.

    Not usually so slow to offer their 'opinions'.

    I guess they 'haven't seen it'.

    LOL.
    Every Saint has a past, every sinner has a future..

  5. #5
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Quote Originally Posted by Yeah Well Fine Then View Post
    I would be especially interested to hear the thoughts of Petey, and Grim, over this one.
    Petey and Grim will avoid being in ear shot off the voices of reason and Conscience when ever possible.
    A proven track record.

  6. #6
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Perhaps we can help them with some excuses?

    1) Susan Kozma is a terrorist

    2) She has links to Al Queda

    3) She is not a real holocaust survivor

    4) She is a Neo Nazi..

    Feel free to add, help them out..
    Every Saint has a past, every sinner has a future..

  7. #7
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    She's on drugs.

    She's old and can't remember.

    She hates herself (because everyone knows that by not supporting Israel you by proxy do not support Jews... :rotz:).

    I really can only think of ludicrous excuses.

  8. #8
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Quote Originally Posted by lisan23 View Post
    She's on drugs.

    She's old and can't remember.

    She hates herself (because everyone knows that by not supporting Israel you by proxy do not support Jews... :rotz:).

    I really can only think of ludicrous excuses.

    That's because the the excuses can only be ludicrous, by definition.

    I guess it is only day TWO of this thread.:

    Maybe if we give it a week or so, at least ONE of the Israeli apologists will drop by, share their thoughts.

    Hard one for them, ya see.

    I mean, there is no way they are going to concur with her patently anti Israeli views, but then, they have to be careful, because she is a genuine survivor, therefore, her word carries a fair bit of weight.

    Will be interesting to see this one play out, Lisa.

    In the meantime..




    Holocaust survivor speaks out against Israel & the Siege of Gaza, endorses Boycott campaign


    On Saturday 30th January Auschwitz survivor Dr. Hajo Meyer, Dr. Haidar Eid of the Islamic University in Gaza and Sara Kershnar of the International Jewish Anti-Zionist Network (IJAN) addressed a standing room only crowd of over 140 people in the Central Hotel in Dublin. The public meeting, entitled “The Misuse of the Holocaust for Political Purposes”, was organised by the Ireland Palestine Solidarity Campaign (IPSC) as part of a high profile speaking tour hosted by IJAN and the Scottish PSC.



    First to speak was Dr. Haidar Eid who addressed the audience via video from besieged Gaza – which he has been unable to leave for several years. He gave a harrowing description of the situation in Gaza today. He reported that one year after Israel’s brutal assault on the region which left over 1,400 people, thousands injured and thousands more homeless, and destroyed the infrastructure of Gaza, the Israeli blockade is still preventing even basic rebuilding supplies from entering the strip.

    Dr. Eid called on people in Ireland to do all they can to help end the siege and the untold suffering that is part and parcel of it. Quoting famed Israeli historian Ilan Pappe, he described Israel’s actions towards the people of Palestine as being a “slow-motion genocide”. He ended by calling for the stepping up of the international Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions campaign against Israel.

    Dr. Meyer, who 65 years ago survived ten months in the Auschwitz Nazi death camp, then spoke to the rapt crowd.

    Reflecting on the fact that it was the end of Holocaust Memorial Week, he despaired of the use of the Holocaust as a political weapon wielded by the state of Israel and its supporters to silence critics of that Apartheid regime. He called this the ‘Holocaust Religion’, of which Elie Wiesel was High Priest. Indeed, the doctor opened by saying that Israel was not a Jewish state in any sense he understood, it was in fact a Zionist state and that Zionism was the antipode of pre-WWII liberal Judaism.

    Dr. Meyer said: “Pre-World War Two Judaism was humanitarian and universalistic in outlook, under which all humans were considered equal.” The doctor contrasted this with political Zionism, “as it now exists in practice, which is xenophobic, nationalist, colonialist and racist. It is an ideology that seeks the maximum number of Palestinians concentrated onto the smallest amount of land”.

    Commenting on what he viewed as the fallacious idea that the existence of the State of Israel was a ‘protector’ of Jews, the doctor pointed out that “the existence of the Chinese State has never prevented a single anti-Chinese pogrom in Indonesia for example”.

    Dr. Meyer further went on to say that the lesson modern Zionism wants people to learn from the Holocaust is that “we Jews have a monopoly on suffering. Therefore, whatever we do to the Palestinians – or anyone else - however horrible, is less that what we suffered” and therefore excusable.

    The doctor pointed to a recent address by Israeli Prime Minister Benjamin Netanyahu at the UN in which he invoked the Nazi Holocaust and the numbers tattooed on survivors’ arms in a propaganda speech justifying an attack on Iran.

    Dr. Meyer contrasted this with the lesson he learned from the Nazi Holocaust, which was that “only those who are themselves dehumanised can attempt to dehumanise others, for example to inflict sufferings such as collective punishment. I personally never want to inflict suffering on anybody.”

    Dr. Meyer continued by saying that “Israel has not the slightest wish to make peace – to Israel peace is an entirely ambivalent term, its means only the peace and freedom to continue carrying out its crimes against the Palestinian people”, and as such, he fully supported the Boycott, Divestment and Sanctions campaign against Israel as a progressive non-violent method of international resistance to Israeli crimes.

    Dr. Meyer commented: “Israel is a world champion at pretending to be an enlightened civilised nation – and nowhere more so than in the realms of academia and the arts. And therefore the BDS campaign, especially in the areas of the cultural and academic boycott, is one of the most effective weapons at our disposal”.

    Dr. Meyer concluded by making clear that “Israelis should not be dehumanised. However, Israel is dehumanising itself through its treatment of Palestinians, and this will be its downfall.”

    Following on, Sara Kershnar, spoke about the global work of the International Jewish Anti-Zionist Network of which both she and Dr. Meyer are members. For more information on JIAN, please see http://www.ijsn.net Ms. Kershnar also reiterated the call for the BDS campaign, and along with IPSC Chairperson Dr. David Landy, highlighted the growing opposition to the Zionist state of Israel amongst Jewish communities worldwide.

    In a final rousing contribution from the floor, Mick Napier of the Scottish PSC reminded everyone present that in the dark days of South African Apartheid in the 1980s, the news that Irish women working for Dunnes Stores were on strike for refusing to handle South African goods, while a small but important act of resistance in Ireland, had a huge positive effect among anti-Apartheid activists in South Africa and worldwide. Mr. Napier concluded that there was no reason why Ireland shouldn’t again be able to play such a role in helping bring about the defeat of Israeli Apartheid today.

    In summing up the meeting, Dr. Landy, speaking from the chair, urged people to not just go home with a sense of anger, but to convert that anger into action and get involved in pro-Palestine activism and the BDS movement in this country through the Ireland Palestine Solidarity Campaign. He pointed out that the IPSC is a multi-faceted campaign that works at grassroots, civil society and political lobbying levels and seeks to build the widest possible support in Irish society for the Palestinian cause – and there is always room for new members in the campaign. For more information on the IPSC please see http://www.ipsc.ie.

    After the Q&A session, the meeting, which was the final event in the IPSC’s national Gaza: A Month of Remembrance program, finished with a long and enthusiastic standing ovation for the speakers.




    http://www.indymedia.ie/article/95664
    Every Saint has a past, every sinner has a future..

  9. #9
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Anyone with a modicum of intellect can easily observe how Israel conducts itself with their use of the Holocaust to justify extortion and silence criticism.

    In fact, all one has to do is look at how Israel treats its Holocaust survivors. The Swiss banks that held Jewish funds at a value of approx $60 million, ended up being extorted to a tune of $1.25 billion. Israel in turn offered their Holocaust survivors a $20/month stipend. How generous. Why should the government get any of the money?


    Holocaust Survivors Blast $20 Stipend
    Jul 31 03:24 PM US/Eastern
    By LAURIE COPANS
    Associated Press Writer

    JERUSALEM (AP) - An Israeli government offer of a new $20 monthly stipend for Holocaust survivors provoked outrage Tuesday, with survivors charging the meager allowance will do nothing to make up for years of neglect of the 240,000 Israelis who lived through Nazi horrors.
    Survivors have long claimed that European countries treat them far better than Israel, where many elderly survivors live in poverty. Prime Minister Ehud Olmert's announcement of the new allowance did nothing to change that impression. One survivor called the offer "absurd and insulting."

    Six million Jews were killed by the Nazis during World War II. Hundreds of thousands who survived concentration camps came to Israel after the war. Many suffered physical or psychological damage from the torture and deprivation they suffered at the hands of the Nazis.

    Six decades after the war ended, the remaining survivors are elderly, and many have been unable to provide for themselves in their final years, suffering chronic shortages of money for medical and psychological treatment and in some cases even food.

    Israel TV showed video of an 85-year-old survivor who said the only meat he could afford was chicken necks.

    Olmert presented his program as a solution.

    "We are correcting a 60-year-old blight," he said. "Holocaust survivors living in Israel are entitled to live respectably without reaching a situation in which it is beyond their means to enjoy a hot meal."

    Beginning next year, the amount allocated for 120,000 needy survivors, about half the total number still living in Israel, will be $28 million annually, according to Olmert's statement.

    But that works out to an average of just $20 a month for each survivor.

    "Of course the survivors cannot accept such an offer," said Dubby Arbel, chairman of the Foundation for the Benefit of Holocaust Survivors in Israel. Arbel said about 65,000 survivors are in acute need of assistance, but his foundation can provide for only half of them.

    Many survivors were outraged. "This doesn't solve anything," said survivor Avraham Roet, 79. "The government doesn't understand the significance of the Holocaust and what horrors the survivors went through. If they did, they wouldn't propose this absurd and insulting plan," he told The Associated Press.

    The new payment is in addition to government support already given to survivors, including those deemed physically or psychologically handicapped, and regular pension payments of about $487 a month.

    Survivors groups charged—in what was meant to be an especially painful dig at the Israeli government—that survivors are treated better in Germany.

    "We know what the conditions of the Holocaust survivors are in Holland, France, Germany and Poland. They are much better than in Israel," Noah Frug, chairman of a consortium of Holocaust survivors' organizations and a survivor himself, told Israel Radio.

    Hillary Kessler-Godin, spokeswoman for Conference on Jewish Material Claims Against Germany, said Germany still pays monthly pensions to 80,000 survivors around the world, after starting in the 1950s.

    "Each survivor's pension can be different depending on their persecution history," she told the AP. Other funds have paid out billions of dollars to various categories of Nazi victims.

    Roet said the average stipend for survivors in Holland, where he was born, is between $2,740 and $4,110 a month.

    Arbel urged Olmert to raise the allowance "for the sake of Jewish identity and Zionist identity, and so that we can all tell our grandchildren that we took care of the Holocaust survivors."

    "For 42 years I received nothing from the state," survivor Kathleen Schwartz, 71, told the newspaper Haaretz. "This grant has arrived too late for thousands of survivors. Time is working against us."

    Critics maintain that more of the nearly $80 billion in reparations Israel has received in compensation from Germany should have gone to the survivors. A large percentage of the money, which was paid beginning in the 1950s as Israelis struggled to build their fledgling state, went to the military and for infrastructure.


    http://www.breitbart.com/article.php...show_article=1
    franKg - "Since God was ok with Moses, Joshua and David burning cities to the ground and killing all the civilians I think he would be ok with us splashing a little water on some terrorists."

    Dr poormouth - "Exackly;
    It's not "waterboarding", it's "extraordinary baptism""

    Quote Originally Posted by carlbenator
    As discussed in a previous thread, this IRRATIONAL HATRED for the Jews and their RIGHT to SURVIVE is one of the many PROOFS of a God, AND a Devil.

  10. #10
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Quote Originally Posted by Americanadian View Post
    Anyone with a modicum of intellect can easily observe how Israel conducts itself with their use of the Holocaust to justify extortion and silence criticism.
    Indeed, they're even treated better in Iran. The Iranian Jews were offered Alia and they refused.

    The Holocaust(tm) survivors are the only source of any moral authority the Zionist Regime has, and it even shits on them and treats them like dirt... LOL.

    Just one more nail in the coffin and closer to the day when Zionst Israel will be abandoned and wiped from the pages of time to be a footnote as one of mankind's worst experiments ever.


    .
    Last edited by dchristie; 06-05-2010 at 04:48 PM.
    "The best case against democracy is a five minute conversation with the average voter"
    -- Winston Churchill

  11. #11
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    It's disgusting, isn't it?

    As with the onion, the more layers one strips away, when it comes to this 'state', the more they then see that aside from casual murder and land theft, they are also culpable of exploiting holocaust survivors.

    The word 'Nazi' is often aimed at anyone on here, who opposes Israel. A transparent ruse. The reality is this - it is the person making that analogy who would have more in common with the rigid, homocidal, racially motivated idealogy of Nazism.
    Every Saint has a past, every sinner has a future..

  12. #12
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    hey, goofy people? how would you stop the smuggling of rockets and other weapons? you want to outlaw handguns in USA but want everybody in gaza to have a stack of rockets?

    you think it's good that iran is sending weapons to the area? how would you stop it?

    if the law says you can't smuggle, that means dig a tunnel and do it anyway? uh, no, it means the houses will be cleared away from the border. it is the same everywhere. always has been.

    it's fools like you that killed rachel corrie. you are responsible for filling your children's head with lies. it will get them killed, too.

  13. #13
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles
    hey, goofy people? how would you stop the smuggling of rockets and other weapons? you want to outlaw handguns in USA but want everybody in gaza to have a stack of rockets?

    you think it's good that iran is sending weapons to the area? how would you stop it?

    if the law says you can't smuggle, that means dig a tunnel and do it anyway? uh, no, it means the houses will be cleared away from the border. it is the same everywhere. always has been.

    it's fools like you that killed rachel corrie. you are responsible for filling your children's head with lies. it will get them killed, too.

    Okay Mumbles, read verrrryyy slowly so it will sink in.

    The rockets attacks against Israel started because of the continued ing land theft by Israel. Israel is continually ignoring International Law by annexing more land and building illegal settlements. The US does not recognize the settlements. Neither does the UN, the various Human Rights Organizations nor the Palestinian victims of Israeli expansion.

    Do you ing understand this or not? Quit spewing your irrelevant shit that insinuates Israel is the victim in this region. They are documented as expanding and stealing Palestinian land. Any violence or response by the Palestinians is the consequences of land theft. Period.

    Now off and come back when you get a brain.
    franKg - "Since God was ok with Moses, Joshua and David burning cities to the ground and killing all the civilians I think he would be ok with us splashing a little water on some terrorists."

    Dr poormouth - "Exackly;
    It's not "waterboarding", it's "extraordinary baptism""

    Quote Originally Posted by carlbenator
    As discussed in a previous thread, this IRRATIONAL HATRED for the Jews and their RIGHT to SURVIVE is one of the many PROOFS of a God, AND a Devil.

  14. #14
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Oh, by the way.

    Rachel Corrie had more courage than you or the entire board of Right Wing Israel apologists could ever muster. She stood in the way of evil and oppression and lost her life because of it.

    It was her courage and sacrifice, along with the oppression of the Palestinian people, that inspired others to send humanitarian ships to try and end the illegal blockade of Gaza. The Palestinian courage and bravery in the face of a monster, inspired Rachel.

    She made a sacrifice that most of your ilk would never even fathom. Your ilk would dig a hole in a sewer to hide from the oppression before you would ever take a stand.

    When oppressors try and suppress the human spirit, it inspires others to take a stand against evil as well. The human spirit is something the regime of Israel will never break. The human spirit that defies oppression exists in the Palestinian people, it existed in Rachel Corrie and it exists in the brave people whom navigated civilian ships into International Wat-ers against a military regime that at one time attacked an American naval vessel without as much as a slap on the wrist as a reprimand.

    Just as the world liberated the Jews from murderous oppression at the hands of Nazi Germany, so to, will the people of the world liberate the Palestinians from Israeli oppression.

    R.I.P Rachel.
    franKg - "Since God was ok with Moses, Joshua and David burning cities to the ground and killing all the civilians I think he would be ok with us splashing a little water on some terrorists."

    Dr poormouth - "Exackly;
    It's not "waterboarding", it's "extraordinary baptism""

    Quote Originally Posted by carlbenator
    As discussed in a previous thread, this IRRATIONAL HATRED for the Jews and their RIGHT to SURVIVE is one of the many PROOFS of a God, AND a Devil.

  15. #15
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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Quote Originally Posted by mumbles View Post
    hey, goofy people?

    ...snip....so, Mr Mumbles, if Ms Kozma were sat opposite you right now, sharing her thoughts on modern Israel, this is what you would think of her, right? That she is 'goofy'?

    Really?
    Every Saint has a past, every sinner has a future..

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    Re: Susan Kozma

    Quote Originally Posted by Americanadian View Post
    Oh, by the way.

    Rachel Corrie had more courage than you or the entire board of Right Wing Israel apologists could ever muster. She stood in the way of evil and oppression and lost her life because of it.
    Well ing said, sir.
    Every Saint has a past, every sinner has a future..

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