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    William Greer

    Did Greer make mistakes in Dealey Plaza? Yes. He faltered and panicked, slowed the limo to look into the back seat, and didn't step on the gas until Kennedy was dead. He made mistakes that a Secret Service Agent should not make, but he he held no weapon.


    The right rear of President Kennedy was blown off by the shot that struck him in the temple. A handgun capable of that would most certainly be heard by Mrs. Connally. The idea that a handgun fired from inside the limousine caused the massive wound at the rear of President Kennedy's head, as opposed to a rifle shot blowing off the back of his head, is one of the most absurd theories to have been put forth. Theories like these do a disservice to the research community.


    Researcher Bill Miller sees that Agent Greer does seem to have his left hand off the steering wheel. Regardless, nothing is in his hand.

    As noted in his Warren Commission testimony, Bill Greer was not a highly trained, highly educated agent. With a 10th grade education, it would have been easy to manipulate Greer into doing anything, including slowing the limousine to a near halt and waiting for the shot that finished Kennedy off, but he was not stupid enough to fire a handgun in an open car with people all around him.
    Last edited by tomtuba; 05-02-2010 at 05:45 AM.

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    The film was altered to remove the gun.

    President Kennedy's murder was a classic "palace guard" scenario--despite the epic cover up, there is overwhelming evidence of a "conspiracy of inaction" by the Secret Service on Elm Street--with Greer and Kellerman in the perfect position to ensure success and a complete, uninterrupted cover up of their crime into the wee hours of the morning of November 23, 1962.

    You may continue to hold on to the LHO or "grassy knoll" theories, but the "Greer did it" information continues to accumulate. Try as you may to explain away, you cannot ignore the facts and evidence documented in the works described below:

    Murder From Within, Newcomb and Adams, 1974 The manuscript for this book is available for viewing in the Library of Congress in Washington DC:

    http://openlibrary.org/b/OL5256447M/Murder_from_within

    Survivor's Guilt: The Secret Service and the Failure to Protect the President, Palamara, 2006 A painstakingly documented study of the SS's action and inaction on November 22, 1963:

    http://www.assassinationresearch.com/v4n1.html

    Definitive Proof: The Secret Service Murder of President John Fitzgerald Kennedy, Robertson, 2006 A brave and pioneering book that is the perfect companion to the newly "stabilized" Zapruder Film:

    http://www.amazon.com/Definitive-Pro.../dp/1430303026

    Image of an Assassination: A New Look at the Zapruder Film, MPI, 1998 Study the medium format version of the film that shows the activity of all occupants of the Limo during the shooting sequence:

    http://www.netflix.com/Movie/Image_o...r&trkid=222336

    Inside the Assassination Records and Review Board, Horne, 2009 An exhaustive, 5 volume magnum opus that has everything the contemporary researcher could desire and more. Horne's work includes some new information on what Clint Hill allegedly saw as he reached the limo and attempts to explain why he allegedly had his gun drawn the entire time at Parkland:

    http://www.amazon.com/Inside-Assassi...f=cm_lmf_tit_5

    And, in the Zapruder Film itself, which shows William Robert Greer turn twice to look directly at JFK, in direct contradiction to his Warren Commission Testimony:



    The second time, Greer fired the fatal head shot to JFK and the film was altered to remove the gun. If you look closely, as some respondents on this forum fail to do, you will see that the area surrounding Greer's hand is blurry in a manner that contrasts with the surrounding image information:



    and



    There is a bountiful supply of facts and evidence that demonstrates unequivocally that the Secret Service ran a uniquely insecure operation in Dallas. Furthermore, rather than turn the matter over to the DPD or FBI, the SS managed the aftermath of the entire event. And, the very agents within Kennedy's limo maintained a "constant vigilance", to quote one of them directly, over JFK's corpse until 3am.

    We must also not forget that SAIC Roy Herman Kellerman was the ranking agent in Dallas. The Zapruder film shows Kellerman turn around and look directly at JFK as the president is visibly showing signs of distress (we see him choking on a bullet at this point in the film) during the hail of gunfire. His reaction? To turn back around calmly and face forward--while Vice President's Johnson's agent steps over the front seat back of his convertible, which was further back in the procession, and forces the vice president to the floor of the car.

    It is within the context of all of this information that we must face the unfortunate possibility that William Robert Greer murdered President John Fitzgerald Kennedy on November 22, 1963.

    With Governor Connolly reclining on to his wife's lap, Greer's alleged trajectory was clear:



    We also have witness statements that shots came from within the car itself, statements of the odor of gunpowder in the street, and one witness--SS Agent Clint Hill--who's November 30, 1963 statement recorded that he heard "the sound of shooting a revolver into something hard". This last statement is highly credible, considering that Agent Hill was very familiar with the sound made by a revolver-he hear them being fired all the time during target practice. The aforementioned links detail these statements as evidence of the crime.

    Furthermore, a detailed ergonomic study of professional drivers (cab drivers in NYC) reveals that the removal of the left hand from the steering wheel while turning to look over their right shoulder into the back seat of their vehicle is unnatural, ergonomically awkward, and for some, uncomfortable. In 100% of these cases, the drivers demonstrated that removal of the right hand from the steering wheel was the natural and comfortable reaction.

    Again, the reaction of William Robert Greer as displayed in the Zapruder film is to rapidly turn to the rear, lean toward JFK, remove his left hand from the wheel and rapidly draw it down as if he were preparing to fire a weapon--all diametrically opposed to his protective service training and muscle memory from hundreds, if not thousands of hours of guarding and driving powerful politicians:



    Once we begin to view Greer as a suspect--as the FBI report may have indicated by the fact that, although they interviewed other agents, they uniquely recorded Greer's physical description, as is customary in dealing with the suspect of a crime--his behavioral pattern during and after the assassination begins to fit together as that of a conspirator.

    Of course, all of this is extremely hard for many researchers and citizens to accept--the very agents assigned to protect the president would never be suspected as assassins--yet this scenario is as old as the history books, fits with much of the testimony, statements, other evidence, and is central to the art of the crime. Alleged SS involvement ensured success--which was the only option when you are talking about political crime at this level.

    Don't let naysayers make blanket statements in a poor attempt to discount the diligent and exhaustive research of the aforementioned authors.

    Read the material and think for yourself. As you do, keep in mind that the vast majority of the evidence that would prove a "palace guard" scenario in the case of the assassination of JFK has been destroyed, suppressed, ignored, bought off, killed off, misrepresented, and more.

    Listen to Greer's answer to the question of whether or not shots came from the general vicinity of the car itself (at 7:40):

    "No. I, I, I ah, I ah, I saw all the evidence of that..."

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sF6reI9kIGI

    And Kellerman's answer (along with a laundry list of the evidence in their possession) at :44:

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ORnwScN9ohE

    Lastly, when you read the banter about this specific topic of Greer shooting Kennedy, keep in mind the fact that if the alleged Secret Service scenario goes mainstream, it is case closed for US Government orchestration of the plot. This fact is the reason you will hardly see much of the aforementioned resources become topics of The Today Show, The Tonight Show, or any major motion picture or bestseller.

    The Secret Service theory is "too hot to handle" for most of the nucleus of the research community. Fear is pervasive, even 47 years later.

    What did Greer reportedly say to the First Lady in Parkland immediately after the assassiation of her husband?

    "Oh, Mrs. Kennedy. Oh my God, Oh my God. I didn't mean to do it."

    So, did this Stewartstown native kill JFK?

    http://www.tyronetimes.co.uk/2617/Di...JFK.4297701.jp



    Release all of the sealed evidence and let us see for ourselves.

    And let us not forget the US Government could not provide evidence to prove beyond a reasonable doubt that Lee Harvey Oswald was the killer. If anything, the 26 Volumes of the Warren Report are the best evidence of a conspiracy we have. Therefore, if the mainstream media expects us to swallow the LHO BS based upon the shoddy work of the WC--as documented exhaustively by Harold Weisberg:

    http://www.spartacus.schoolnet.co.uk/JFKweisberg.htm

    --then demands of crystalline "proof" that Greer shot JFK fall flat in the sphere of public opinion--which is the only "trial" available for the foreseeable future.

    Greer WAS a highly trained and experienced agent of the United States Secret Service. He performed the functions of armed bodyguard and driver over a long career in the protective service.

    While this theory may shake the foundation of the "conspiracy theory industry", it is the stubborn opposition to this theory by some in the "research community" that does a disservice to history and the future of our world.

    Fortunately, more contemporary researchers have open minds and choose not to ignore the elephant in the room--the distinct possibility that Secret Service Agent William Robert Greer Murdered President John Fitzgerald Kennedy on November 22, 1963.
    Last edited by greerdidit; 05-03-2010 at 12:36 AM.

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    Re: William Greer



    You honestly think you see a smudge?....of a gun?....

    Really, you're ing with us here, right?
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    Re: William Greer

    Yes. Solving a crime requires clues--and the Science of Deduction. The rapid movement of Greer's left hand in the Zapruder film hundredths of second before JFK's head is blown off is a single clue--among many other such clues in the case--that helps guide us to the conclusion that he is holding a gun.

    A multitude of aforementioned clues exist pointing to the Secret Service as the conspirators--especially Greer and Kellerman.

    Is it not incredible that SS Agent Clint Hill stated that he heard the sound of a revolver discharging into something hard?

    Is it not incredible that other eye witnesses are on the record as having stated they saw shots fired within the limo?

    Yes, these components of the historical record are absolute bombshell clues when pieced together with a clear image of Greer in the Zapruder Film and the Parkland Doctors testimony of a frontal entrance wound.

    There are also far too many clues residing in the mega cover up, illustrating how important it was for Greer to PERSONALLY control the prima facie evidence, and perjure himself even with Specter carefully guiding him through the landmines, or changing the subject when other witnesses came too close to the truth.

    And for those who cry foul or call for justice for Greer--what about JFK--don't we owe it to our fallen president to follow these clues, even if they shatter our illusion that the United States President is not an independent executive--but rather a controlled figurehead who can be eliminated by those charged to protect him or her?



    The answer is--unequivocally--yes. President John Fitzgerald Kennedy was a hero who paid the ultimate price for standing against the *****ful interests who have infiltrated the American government. We owe it to him to fully explore every angle--even if it is diabolical.

    These interests were so *****ful that they could order the very agents sworn to protect the president to kill him in broad daylight--and then cover up the crime. This is how it happened folks--and it makes a hell of a lot of sense from the perspective of those who had to design the perfect political murder--a US President could only be murdered if the US Secret Service allowed it to happen--END OF DISCUSSION.

    EVERYONE knew Dallas was a red-hot city and there were threats all over the Secret Service's radar--which is why THEY DESTROYED ALL OF THEIR RECORDS BEFORE THEY COULD BE BROUGHT BEFORE THE PUBLIC.

    Now pay close attention and follow along with me as I re-state the facts: DESPITE YEARS OF TRAINING TO REACT INSTANTANEOUSLY TO ASSASSINATION ATTEMPTS, AND A CLEAR UNDERSTANDING AMONG THE PROTECTIVE SERVICE THAT DALLAS WAS HOSTILE, AND THE MULTIPLE THREATS PRECEDING JFK'S TRIP, AND MULTIPLE GUNSHOTS WHIZZING AROUND THEM IN DEALEY PLAZA, ROY KELLERMAN AND WILLIAM GREER SLOW THE LIMO TO A CRAWL AND JUST SIT AND WATCH THE PRESIDENT UNTIL THEY ARE SURE HE IS DEAD--AND THERE ARE A NUMBER OF CLUES THAT IT GETS EVEN WORSE!


    Just recently, a US Government researcher who worked for the Assassination Records and Review Board has published an exhaustively researched book (five volumes) and has given multiple interviews--essentially stating that Greer should be viewed as a suspected gunman--there is a distinct possibility that the frontal shot originated from Greer. It doesn't get any better than that folks--I'm sorry!

    You can continue to be assholes and you can continue ignore the historical record all you want--trading logic for insults--it may help you keep your own sanity. However, no matter how far down the rabbit hole we must go--go there we must, even if it shatters the comforting myth that the US President is an independent executive--vs a figurehead that can be eliminated by his own protection if he fails to comply with the true masters.

    Get it?

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    Re: William Greer

    Did Greer make mistakes in Dealey Plaza? Yes. He faltered and panicked, slowed the limo to look into the back seat, and didn't step on the gas until Kennedy was dead. He made mistakes that a Secret Service Agent should not make. He should have been brought up on charges, yet he was actually praised for his service. That should tell you something.


    The right rear of President Kennedy was blown off by the shot that struck him in the temple. A handgun capable of that would most certainly be heard by those in the car who, you have to think, certainly would have said something. The idea that a handgun fired from inside the limousine caused the massive wound at the rear of President Kennedy's head, while hard to swallow, can not be ruled out and makes more sense than the Single Bullet Theory.


    .
    With a 10th grade education, it would have been easy to manipulate Greer into doing anything, including slowing the limousine to a near halt and waiting for the shot that finished Kennedy off.

    Now that we know that Greer participated in the assassination in one way that we can see with our own eyes; there is no reason to dismiss further involvement without strict examination of available evidence.

    I am now holding my opinion open until I read "Inside the Assassination Records Review Board."

    Anyway, Greer may as well have shot Kennedy since he clearly didn't help him.


    Greer is guilty of the murder of President Kennedy , one way or another.

    Last edited by tomtuba; 06-21-2010 at 03:57 AM.

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    Re: William Greer

    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DguBcLpWBS0 When the Greer theory first came out it was promoted by William Cooper, Greer shot JFK with a chrome plated hand gun that shot darts, laced with shell fish toxin. The reflection on Kellerman's head was supposed to be the chrome plated hand gun, when that was debunked, as this video shows, now they say the Z film was doctored. :freak3:

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    Re: William Greer

    Quote Originally Posted by porsteamboy View Post
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=DguBcLpWBS0 When the Greer theory first came out it was promoted by William Cooper, Greer shot JFK with a chrome plated hand gun that shot darts, laced with shell fish toxin. The reflection on Kellerman's head was supposed to be the chrome plated hand gun, when that was debunked, as this video shows, now they say the Z film was doctored. :freak3:

    You are mixing two shots; the one that hit JFK in the neck; and the fatal shot that hit him in the temple.

    The shots themselves have not been debunked; yet the Single Bullet Theory clearly has been debunked.

    The only question that remains is where the neck and temple shot came from.

    The missed shot and the shot that hid Kennedy in the back and the back of the head, clearly came from behind him; most likely the Dal Tex Building and/or the 5th floor of the Book Building.


    Your attempt to confuse and quickly end this matter has failed.

    While I do not believe, at this time, that the fatal ( temple ) shot came from Greer, I realize that it had to come from that direction.

    The most absurd theory in all this is the Single Bullet Theory. This silly theory ( SBT) is so absurd that with the AARB inquiry on the table, even Greer shot Kennedy seems more plausible.

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    Re: William Greer

    yet the Single Bullet Theory clearly has been debunked.

    Wrong again! Don't you people ever do a checking?

    A Discovery Channel special "Unsolved History: JFK Beyond the Magic Bullet", attempted to replicate, as well as possible, the conditions of that day. The participants set up blocks of ballistics gel with a substance similar to human bone inside. These studies showed that largely undeformed bullets were possible to produce, if they were slowed by a passage though a tissue-like substance before striking bone. Next, two mannequin figures made of ballistic anatomical substances (animal skin, gelatin, and interior bone-like cast) were set up in the exact relative position of JFK and Connally. A marksman, from a distance equal to that of the sixth floor of the Book Depository building, fired the same rifle model found in the Book Depository, using a round from the same batch of "Western Case Cartridge Company" 6.5x52 mm ammunition purchased with the surplus Carcano weapon in early 1963. The path of their single bullet (followed by high speed photography) duplicated, almost exactly, the wounds suffered by the victims that day, the only difference being that the bullet did not quite have enough ****** to penetrate the "thigh" substance in front of the Connally figure, because it struck an extra bone in the "rib" model (i.e., it fractured 2 ribs in the model vs. one rib in Connally). It was also slightly more deformed than CE 399, possibly for the same reason. However, this bullet came close to duplicating all wounds in both men with a single shot, with a bullet having little deformation.[67]
    In 1993 a computer animator named Dale Myers embarked on a 10-year project[68] to completely render the events of November 22 in 3D computer animation. His results were shown as part of ABC's documentary The Kennedy Assassination: Beyond Conspiracy in 2003, and won an Emmy award.

    To render his animation, Myers took photographs, home footage, blueprints and plans, and attempted to use them to create an accurate computer reenactment of the assassination. His work was assessed by Z-Axis who have been involved in producing computer generated animations of events, processes and concepts for major litigations in the United States and Europe.

    Their assessment concluded that Myers' animation allowed the assassination sequence to be viewed "from any point of view with absolute geometric integrity" and that they "believe that the thoroughness and detail incorporated into his work is well beyond that required to present a fair and accurate depiction."[69]

    Myers' animation found that the bullet wounds were consistent with JFK's and Governor Connally's positions at the time of shooting, and that by following the bullet's trajectory backwards could be found to have originated from a narrow cone including only a few windows of the sixth floor of the School Book Depository, one of which was the sniper's nest of boxes from which the rifle barrel had been seen protruding by witnesses.

    In the same ABC documentary, Myers uses a close-up examination of the Zapruder film to justify the "single bullet theory." He claims to have found a little-known anomaly on the Zapruder film. When Kennedy's limousine appears from behind the street sign in Dealey Plaza, there is a moment seen between frames 223 and 224 on the Zapruder film where the right side lapel of Governor Connally's jacket appears to "pop out," as if being pushed from within by an unseen force. Myers theorizes that this is the moment of impact, when both Kennedy and Connally were struck by the same bullet from Oswald's rifle. Myers also points out that in frames 225-230 of the Zapruder film, as Kennedy appears from behind the street sign both Kennedy and Connally are simultaneously reacting in pain to the impact of the bullet.
    What were the results of CT and their expirements?....oh wait...they didn't do any. They just talk.

    Science! It works. Bitches.
    Last edited by LogicallyYours; 06-21-2010 at 12:38 PM.
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    Re: William Greer

    Again....WHERE ARE THE EXPIREMENTS DONE BY THOSE WHO WISH TO DEBUNK THE SINGLE-BULLET THEORY???....WHERE???? WHY HAVEN'T SPEND THE TIME RATHER THAN RUNNING THEIR MOUTHS?????
    "Religion is a heavy suitcase: all you have to do is put it down."
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    Re: William Greer

    There has been plenty of "Oswald could have made the shots," testing done by both sides. What are you talking about now?

    A fair approach would be to follow the evidence in the case and see where it leads.

    But that would involve not having a pre-determined conclusion.

    My suggestion to you my friend is to simply look at this case with an open mind.

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    Re: William Greer

    Really?...point to an detailed recreation of the shot from the window that supports you nutter theory? Show me to recreation that supports your position.

    Explain how the Discovery and History channels recreation was inaccurate.
    "Religion is a heavy suitcase: all you have to do is put it down."
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    Re: William Greer Assassinated John F. Kennedy

    "Douglas Horne served on the staff of the President John F. Kennedy Assassination Records Review Board (ARRB) during the final three years of its four-year lifespan, from 1995 to 1998, and is the first U.S. government official involved with the medical evidence to allege a coverup in President Kennedy's autopsy, and in the creation of the autopsy photographs and x-rays. This book, the product of over 13 years of writing and research, provides the best explanation yet offered of the true nature of the medical coverup in the assassination of John F. Kennedy, and does so in meticulous detail, with scrupulous use of primary source material. It incorporates the latest information---much of it new evidence not revealed elsewhere---gleaned from the ARRB's depositions and interviews of medical witnesses, conducted from 1996 to 1998. With precise accuracy, and with a relentless focus on the massive fraud uncovered in the official records of the 35th President's assassination, Horne presents a persuasive case that the assassination of JFK was an "inside job," a true coup d'etat in America, that was ruthlessly and brazenly covered up by those who 'broke the back of the American century' in Dallas on November 22, 1963."

    In his 2009 book, Inside the Assassination Records and Review Board, Volume IV, pg 164 Horne states the following:

    "The very unpleasant and tentative possibility exists that limousine Driver William Greer fired a fourth head shot into the President's left temple with his revolver." (Author's emphasis added.)

    He then outlines for the reader what clues and evidence support this statement.




    A very convincing CONTEMPORARY case is being developed against William Robert Greer--Robertson has brought it forth (after pioneers Newcomb and Adams)--now Horne makes it credible.

    Yes, we can cast aside the inane LHO / SBT myths--leaving them to the usual and blind-faith suspects and agents of disinformation.

    As for the rest of the crowd, let's follow the truth wherever it may lead, shall we?

    It's 2010 and we're finally getting there--on November 22, 1963 Roy Herman Kellerman and William Robert Greer took the lead roles in both the assassination of President John Fitzgerald Kennedy and the cover up of their murderous and treasonous crime.

    Forget the Book Depository and Grassy Knoll--study the Secret Service instead--the assassins were surrounding JFK. Read Palamara's Survivor's Guilt to put everything in proper context. Palamara cryptically calls Greer "The Most Important Agent".

    Now if we can just get Horne's observations included in Greer's rather sanitary Wikipedia entry

    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/William_Greer

    Anyone care to assist?
    Last edited by greerdidit; 06-28-2010 at 07:47 PM.

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    Re: William Greer

    Quote Originally Posted by theme View Post
    You are mixing two shots; the one that hit JFK in the neck; and the fatal shot that hit him in the temple.

    The shots themselves have not been debunked; yet the Single Bullet Theory clearly has been debunked.

    The only question that remains is where the neck and temple shot came from.

    The missed shot and the shot that hid Kennedy in the back and the back of the head, clearly came from behind him; most likely the Dal Tex Building and/or the 5th floor of the Book Building.


    Your attempt to confuse and quickly end this matter has failed.

    While I do not believe, at this time, that the fatal ( temple ) shot came from Greer, I realize that it had to come from that direction.

    The most absurd theory in all this is the Single Bullet Theory. This silly theory ( SBT) is so absurd that with the AARB inquiry on the table, even Greer shot Kennedy seems more plausible.
    The single bullet theory is possible with 6.5 carcano full metal jacketed round nosed bullet, the only problem I have with it, is they had to move the upper back wound to the lower neck also the condition of CE-399. All of the doctors testified that it was possible, if you ignored the condition of CE-399.

  14. #14

    William Greer

    Really and as I have not guessed earlier

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    Re: William Greer

    Quote Originally Posted by porsteamboy View Post
    the only problem I have with it, is they had to move the upper back wound to the lower neck also the condition of CE-399.

    Then it was not possible - period.

    Get over it and move on.

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    Re: William Greer

    Quote Originally Posted by LogicallyYours View Post
    Really?...point to an detailed recreation of the shot from the window that supports you nutter theory? Show me to recreation that supports your position.
    You damn fool. How can we recreate something that never happened in the first place.


    The proof that Oswald was not there is the fact that none of the four men upstairs who were on the fifth and/or sixth floors said that they had seen him there, which they absolutely must have if he was there.


    Bonnie Ray Williams was on the sixth floor to within three minutes of the shooting, in a position where he would have seen - and probably did see - whoever was in the "sniper's nest" area.

    Jack Dougherty was standing "ten feet west of the west elevator" - that is, directly in the path of the fleeing assassin (which scenario was only necessary if Oswald was the shooter having to hurry downstairs to meet Baker & Truly in the second floor lunchroom within 90 seconds) - and was not run over by Oswald as he had to have been.
    Last edited by theme; 10-05-2010 at 12:09 PM.

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