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  1. #17
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    MarketWave Alerts(tm) is copyrighted material. Alerts may be freely copied or forwarded in their entirety only under the condition that they not be edited or revised in any way, the MarketWave web site address be included, and the non-subscriber recipient be agreeable to receiving it. It is the belief of MarketWave that the information presented is accurate and truthful as of the date of the Alert. Any and all commentary is the expressed opinions, views and beliefs of Len Clements protected under the U.S. Constitution. Len Clements is not an attorney nor should any part of any Alert be construed as legal advice, nor should it replace the advice of competent legal council.
    Ditto for this site, Lenny!!!! The posters here have the same right butthead and you being here would jeopardize that. What is good for the goose is good for the gander. So, post away here folks and Lenny can use his own site to do the same!!!

    Soapboxmom

  2. #18
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    So today I get this e-mail regarding the Lenny situation that reads in part...

    But ...

    If you really think about it, Len out-manoeuvred everybody and accomplished something he wanted done ... total blindside ... Gotta give him kudos on the brilliance of that move,.
    Very sharp on his part.

    Who would've thunk it, eh?

    Like a chess game.
    See, that's what pisses me off about this whole deal.

    Clements thinking he's pulled a fast one on us.

    I'll admit you're clever, Clements, but not quite that clever.

    Quote Originally Posted by put it out there baby View Post
    What happened to the Lenny thread? Did he finally come on here as a mod and delete his thread?
    Quote Originally Posted by Doc Bunkum View Post
    Not quite.

    It still exists in the Google cache.
    Quote Originally Posted by put it out there baby View Post
    Then it needs to be re-posted.
    Good idea.

    So in case anybody is looking for anything, here are the links to the first 10 pages on the original version of this thread that went mysteriously AWOL.

    Len Clements - Who is he anyway? version 1.0

    Page 1

    Page 2

    Page 3

    Page 4

    Page 5

    Page 6

    Page 7

    Page 8

    Page 9

    Page 10

    I think all those links should work.

    A lot of the stuff in those first 10 pages is a lot of stupid stuff by Heiney and Doyley.

    But if anybody remembers posting some real good stuff, I suggest you go hunting for it and repost it in this thread.

    I'll post the next 10 links later. yb:

  3. #19
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    That is excellent! good job! I think we should start re-posting the good posts on those pages right here. I will do some when I have time also. Keep posting the links and we can go there, copy the decent posts and paste them here and re-create the best and most important parts of that thread! Brilliant! Thanks for doing that!

  4. 04-24-2010, 06:57 PM


  5. #20
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?


    02-08-2010, 12:39 PM

    cyclemaster
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    Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    Who is Len Clements anyway? If you review his website at www.marketwaveinc.com it would seem as if he is one of the top authorities in the MLM industry. He claims to be a member of Mensa and "court certified" expert for all things MLM, but who is the real Len Clements.

    I have heard his name for years, but never really knew he was, what specific networking expertise he held or even what successes he had personally building businesses in the networking industry. It is apparent upon first review that he holds a lot of knowledge in the industry of MLM, but when you dig a little deeper, review his online and offline behaviors and look into his past professional failures and successes, is the name Len Clements worthy of mentioning with those same names as Rod Cook and other network marketing gurus. Looking forward to hearing any and all experiences, knowledge and information for all things related to Len Clements. Please let's keep this thread factual and accurate.

  • #21
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-10-2010, 12:21 PM
    cyclemaster
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    No, I think I will ask members of this community that might be familiar with the other failures that Lenny has led the charge in and their personal experiences with Lenny.

    Seems he has a pattern of failing in this industry according to his own website at www.marketwaveinc.com and the biggest red flags seem to be the repeated lawsuits within this industry that he seems to be apart of.

    No, seriously. Review the resume on his website as well as his own posts on these boards bragging about the lawsuits he is involved in. All of this is absolutely fact, backed up by his own words.


  • #22
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-10-2010, 01:49 PM
    cyclemaster
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    It appears that Len founded a network marketing company called Epic Network (www.epiccoffee.com), but resigned for ethical reasons. Would love to get more information on this as the company appears to have gone out of business within 12 months of opening. Since Len was the founder and CEO and he states that he resigned for ethical reasons it just seems odd that you resign for ethical reasons when you are the founder and CEO. Anyone else know why this company failed so quickly or what the story was behind Len Clements resignation from his own company?

  • #23
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-11-2010, 05:56 PM
    skyvoyager
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    Here's a post I made about Len on the "Don't Lose Your Shorts With Bill Farley's ZRII" thread. Page 7, post #310.
    -------------------------------------------------------------------

    You know.. whenever a self-styled MLM guru comes on here and professes that the key to "unlimited wealth and lifetime residual income" lies thru network marketing.. I just gotta know more!!! Such is the case with Lenord W. Clements --owner of Marketwave, Inc.

    On Len's home page he states " I love network marketing and make my living at it. I am one of its biggest advocates." I do indeed believe that with all my heart and soul.

    Len's biography states this high school grad (with an IQ of 155 but no college?) began his network marketing career in 1979 --30 years ago (back when MLM wasn't such a derogatory term). Along the way he branched of into other ventures --computer rentals, barter promotions, author, speaker, MLM consulting and expert' witness' services. The list of MLM's he admits to in his bio includes some of the big names in 'the industry.'

    Anyway, I'm always curious to check out the "Lifestyles of the MLM Rich and Famous".. especially one who's been at it 30 years!!! Len published his home/ office address on his website. The fact he came here (to Scam.com) to make himself known tells me I'm not revealing anything he hasn't already done himself.

    My first stop is to do a Google search of the address. I'm expecting to see a typical 'MLM Mansion' (or at least McMansion) with the great landscaping, flashy cars, fountains, pools etc... the sort you see on all those recruitment materials.

    Ummm... "Houston we have a problem."

    What I got was this.

    Ooooookaaaay... next stop, the tax appraisal website. First, he's not technically in Las Vegas... but in a seperate incorporated municipality someplace east of NORTH Las Vegas called "Sunrise Manor." (Sounds a bit 'senior citizeny' but hey... what hypes in Vegas...).

    Anyhow, I've got to admit his 1,322 sq' wood frame/stucco, 3br/2ba, 2 car garage home on 1/4 acre is nice enough. At least it's not on wheels as were a couple others I checked out... and one a lot of people would love to. I guess I was expecting more (What really hurts is it looks like he bought it in September 2007 for $250,000.. and the appraised value for '09/10 is $127,969... a loss of $122k...ouch!!!).

    Anyway... I'm guessing Len has his millions stashed elsewhere. If so I'm impressed to see a 30 year titan of network marketing living so frugally.

    I'll leave you all to draw your own conclusions as I have. All this baloney about MLN wealth is just that... ground up udders, lungs, lips, eyeballs and fat all spiced up, sliced and served up on white bread with mayo.

    If this is how a 30 year veteran and industry expert lives then what hope is there for the rest of you? My advice, stop drinking the Kool Aid... stop selling the Kool Aid and get a legitimate job.




  • #24
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-14-2010, 07:11 PM
    fastmoney
    Court "Certified" Anti- MLM Expert!
    Join Date: Mar 2007
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    Posts: 953



    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Live&Learn
    You're right. It's sad to watch Len destroy his reputation because he cannot break his message board addiction. I've tried to help him, but he refuses to learn. If Yoli goes down the tubes, as you believe it will, I will give Len the credit.

    Well it will not be Len's fault.. Don't give him the credit..

    Give the credit to the 6 founders who thought it would be OK to charge $3+ for a cap.. then tell reps they should replace drinking sodas with Yoli..

    Massive failure in not realizing that most people will cannot pay $90 a month to drink one Yoli a day.. Or $360 for a family of 4..

    And that is just for one a day....

    __________________
    The guy who cuts my grass's house is bigger and nicer than the "court certified expert".. MLMer on this board... I am not kidding... Of course how hard do you have to work to have a house bigger than 1,322 Sq Ft.. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=2Ox1Tore9nw

  • #25
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-15-2010, 08:48 AM

    cyclemaster
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    Lenny this thread is just for fact gathering for the purposes of due diligence for those that are considering joining you in business.

    If you have something to add or rebut it is welcomed, but there is no requirement for someone to disclose their identity or have a live debate with you.

    You obviously have a long track record of being involved in lawsuits and I don't think that anyone would want to subject themselves to a frivolous complaint just because you appear to be addicted to both online and offline conflict.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MWave
    Athelstan Wagner, you are apparently the only one here that, allegedly, has the cahonas to identify themselves. Although its interesting that your full name doesn't result in one, single hit on Google (other than the Yoli thread) which is almost impossible now days. Especially for someone that is "an owner of several bars and nightclubs" and also has an "fm radio show". Yet, not a single hit. Not one.

    But wait... this is a thread about accusatory hypothetical questions about me, isn't it?

    So, since you have, allegedly, identified yourself, so don't have the "I'm too afwaid of those big bad MLMers" excuse, and you're an FM radio host, so can't use the "I'm just not a very good public speaker" excuse, why don't you and your pack of trolls here gather all of your intel on me for another week or so, then when you're ready, lets get on a conference call and you can hit me with every question and accusation you want - no time limit. We can both record it and post it online, unedited.

    Because, I mean, you all aren't just making up a bunch of crap here just to get back at me for making complete fools of you all over on the Yoli board... right?

    Right?

    Len





  • #26
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-16-2010, 07:21 AM
    Soapboxmom
    Senior Scambusting Moderator ---- Don't mess with Mom!!!!!
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ohein56
    Why is it a problem that Len kept his distance from NADN after he did some initial consulting work for them?

    It clearly sounds as though they (NADN), didn't take any advice from him either! Doesn't it?

    A vacuum is easy to fill with baloney, huh?!

    There's alot of holes in your 'theory' SV. JMO

    I hope you can get Len to help you fill in all the gaps, and why wouldn't he do that for you?! You're such a nice guy n all....

    Kerry


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by MWave
    I understand that you are very confused, so I'll indulge this one, because its just so easy.

    As the previously posted information clearly stated, I was hired by NADN to do nothing more than design their compensation plan. I never "vouched" for them in any way. They were emphatic at the time about "doing it right" and not following the same path as TTP.

    One (of many) legal issues with TTP was that they sold a business opportunity that offered tax deductions by starting your own business - of selling the same business opportunity. It was a closed loop.

    My advice to NADN was to make sure that the "business opportunity" that their members gleaned the tax benefits from was some OTHER business than NADN. And that is, in fact, exactly what they did. Unfortunately, some of those "other" businesses were just shells designed to only reap tax benefits. They were indicted for this over three years after I stopped working with them.

    And during that same time period I was actively exposing and/or testifying against The Tax People and several other scams.

    But, of course, that doesn't count, does it?

    Len



    Kerry,

    How ignorant can you be? Len wrote the compensation plan. He sat by and watched while 100,000 people were defrauded and did nothing to stop it, so it appears. Having designed the comp plan one would think it likely he did pay close attention to how the business was doing. He staked his reputation and credibility on it as the author of the compensation plan. Writing comp plans isn't easy as this old post clearly shows.

    Soapboxmom

  • #27
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-16-2010, 07:31 AM

    cyclemaster
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    My question again is, after he was paid to consult for the second illegal tax scheme while getting paid to testify against the first illegal tax scheme was he then paid to testify against the second illegal tax scheme that he was paid to consult for?


    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ohein56
    Why is it a problem that Len kept his distance from NADN after he did some initial consulting work for them?

    It clearly sounds as though they (NADN), didn't take any advice from him either! Doesn't it?

    A vacuum is easy to fill with baloney, huh?!

    There's alot of holes in your 'theory' SV. JMO

    I hope you can get Len to help you fill in all the gaps, and why wouldn't he do that for you?! You're such a nice guy n all....

    Kerry





  • #28
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-17-2010, 11:00 AM
    cyclemaster
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    Still awaiting your answers on these. Let me know if you would like me to repost one at a time. I think new people reviewing this board deserve to know the real truth about your background in the industry you are trying to personally recruit them in.

    1) Why do you believe that the local municipalities can tax a product or product category that the state won't?

    2) Please provide a link to your 3 day training in Bangkok, Thailand you landed on a week's notice. Why was it postponed?

    3) What exactly were your reasons for quitting Epic Network, the company you founded and were CEO for? You stated on your website it was for ethical reasons, but since you were an owner, founder and the CEO why do you quit your own company for ethical reasons when you have enough control to fix whatever ethical reasons you may have had?

    5) Why did you leave Zenza? Your website says "mutually agreed upon departure...". Does this mean you were fired or they just agreed with you that it was also in their best interest if you resigned?

    6) Tell us more about the lawsuit that is currently filed against you. Were you sued for breach of contract, slander, libel, all of the above?

  • #29
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-17-2010, 11:56 AM
    cyclemaster
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    Lenny said that he is currently being sued and in turn filed a counter claim, but he won't say who or what for.

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by Live&Learn
    Who sued Lenny?



  • #30
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-17-2010, 12:14 PM
    Erneston
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ohein56
    Here's some 'proof' of him having a solid reputation in MLM for you.

    CLICK HERE!


    LOL, are you really stupid enough to adduce that as "proof", Kerry?!

    That's "proof" like a listing of an MLM-juice in the Physicians' Desk Reference is "proof" that it has medical benefits.

  • #31
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-17-2010, 12:59 PM
    James R
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    Quote:
    Originally Posted by ohein56
    Who is Len Clements?

    Why don't you give a few of these people a call and ask them? He's certainly rubbing shoulders with some of the "best of the best!"

    CLICK HERE!

    Kerry

    {PS ...and if you think they're ALL a bunch of crooks and con artists because of their involvement in MLM/NWM, there's not much I can do for you!}


    I wouldn't suspect that the "MLMInsider.Com" page would be the best source of proving whether or not someone is a crook or a con artist in mlm.

    Did you notice that most of the people on that page were "growth coaches", "mlm coaches", "motivational speakers" ect....? I guess if you choose to teach and motivate other people how to lose money, then I guess that gives them a way to clear their conscience.

    The people I am most concerned with are the ones who are "blasting" KoolAide caps into a full bottles of water that has been shipped accross the country. Most kids would find that as being "cool" but I am not impressed with the colored water exhibition....regardless of how it happened.

    Actually when you think about it, I can almost guarantee it is more "profitable" on the motivational end of the scheme. It's probably alot less work than trying to convince people that "blasting" KoolAide into bottles of water is real business proposition.

    The funny thing is when you read the bios of some of these mlm "coaches", they have been down a road or two.. or five.... or ten. They truly understand how if feels to be on the "blasting" end of a business opportunity. Maybe they finally got it figured out.

  • #32
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    02-17-2010, 03:30 PM
    Live&Learn
    Learning is fun!
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    Re: Len Clements - Who is he anyway?

    I think we should let Lenny speak in his own words!

    http://www.freestylesteam.com/

    "I believe Yoli can realistically grab 10% market-share and when it does Yoli will be one of the largest companies in the MLM marketplace, of all time. And I honestly think 20% is conservative. And if you know me, you know I'm not prone to exaggeration and hype"


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