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    G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Goodbye hispanic vote...

    *****************************************

    G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration
    By DAVID D. KIRKPATRICK

    WASHINGTON, March 29 ó The battle among Republicans over immigration policy and border security is threatening to undercut a decade-long effort by President Bush and his party to court Hispanic voters, just as both parties are gearing up for the 2006 elections.

    "I believe the Republican Party has hurt itself already," said the Rev. Luis Cortes, a Philadelphia pastor close to President Bush and the leader of a national organization of Hispanic Protestant clergy members, saying he delivered that message to the president last week in a meeting at the White House.

    To underscore the contested allegiance of Hispanic voters, Mr. Cortes said, he also took a delegation of Hispanic ministers to meet with the leaders of both parties last week, including what he called a productive discussion with Howard Dean, the Democratic chairman.

    The immigration and security debate, which has sparked huge demonstrations in recent days by Hispanic residents of cities around the country, comes at a crucial moment for both parties.

    Over the last three national elections, persistent appeals by Mr. Bush and other Republican leaders have helped double their party's share of the Hispanic vote, to more than 40 percent in 2004 from about 20 percent in 1996. As a result, Democrats can no longer rely on the country's 42 million Hispanic residents as a natural part of their base.

    In a lunch meeting of Senate Republicans this week, Senator Mel Martinez of Florida, the only Hispanic Republican in the Senate, gave his colleagues a stern warning. "This is the first issue that, in my mind, has absolutely galvanized the Latino community in America like no other," Mr. Martinez said he told them.

    The anger among Hispanics has continued even as the Senate Judiciary Committee proposed a bill this week that would allow illegal immigrants a way to become citizens. The backlash was aggravated, Mr. Martinez said in an interview, by a Republican plan to crack down on illegal immigrants that the House approved last year.

    The outcome remains to be seen. Speaker J. Dennis Hastert said on Wednesday that he recognized the need for a guest-worker program, opening the door to a possible compromise on fiercely debated immigration legislation.

    Democrats see an opportunity to "show Hispanics who their real friends are," as Senator Charles E. Schumer of New York, chairman of the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, put it.

    But the issue is a delicate matter for Democrats as well. Polls show large majorities of the public both support tighter borders as a matter of national security, and oppose amnesty for illegal immigrants. Many working-class Democrats resent what they see as a continuing influx of cheap labor.

    The stakes are enormous because Hispanics now account for one of every eight United States residents, and for about half the recent growth in the country's population. Although Hispanics cast just 6 percent of the votes in the 2004 elections, birth rates promise an imminent explosion in the number of eligible voters.

    "There is a big demographic wave of Hispanic kids who are native born who will be turning 18 in even greater numbers over the next three, four and five election cycles," Roberto Suro, director of the nonpartisan Pew Hispanic Center, said.

    Nowhere is the immigration debate more heated than Arizona, where about 28 percent of the population is Hispanic and where Senator Jon Kyl, a Republican sponsor of an immigration bill, faces what could be a difficult race for re-election. Both Mr. Kyl and his Democratic challenger, Jim Pederson, have hired Hispanics or Hispanic-dominated firms to manage their campaigns.

    A mostly Hispanic crowd of about 20,000 gathered outside Mr. Kyl's office last weekend to protest criminal penalties against illegal immigrants that were in the House Republican bill, even though Mr. Kyl's proposal does not include the measure.

    Mario E. Diaz, the campaign manager for Mr. Pederson, faulted Mr. Kyl's proposal, which would require illegal immigrants or future temporary workers to return to their countries before becoming eligible for legal status in the United States.

    "Speaking the language that Kyl does, which is round them up and deport them, is offensive and disgusting to the Latino community," Mr. Diaz said.

    Mr. Kyl, for his part, accused Democrats of race-baiting by painting all Republicans as anti-Hispanic, a practice he said most Hispanics resent. But the senator also acknowledged some fears that the immigration debate could repel Hispanic voters. He added, "I would hope that some of our colleagues who don't have much of a Hispanic population in their states would at least defer to those of us who do."

    Pollsters from each party say Hispanics, like other groups, typically rank immigration lower in importance than other issues, especially education. But they respond strongly when they believe the rhetoric surrounding the debate demonizes immigrants or Hispanics, as they did when Gov. Pete Wilson of California, a Republican, backed a 1994 initiative to exclude illegal immigrants from public schools and services.

    Many analysts say the backlash from Hispanics wrecked the California Republican party for a decade.

    As governor of Texas, Mr. Bush opposed such measures, and pushed Republicans to woo Hispanics.

    Last week, Sergio Bendixen, a pollster for the Democratic Senatorial Campaign Committee, released a rare multilingual poll in which 76 percent of legal Latin American immigrants said they believed anti-immigrant sentiment was on the rise. A majority of immigrants said they believed the immigration debate was unfair and misinformed.

    But Ken Mehlman, chairman of the Republican National Committee, dismissed such concerns. Mr. Mehlman said the party's image was defined by President Bush, who supports a temporary-worker program and has repeatedly urged Republicans to avoid inflammatory rhetoric.

    "In an emotional debate like this," Mr. Mehlman said, "people need to lower their energy and remember that ultimately the goal is something that is consistent with being a nation of laws and a nation of immigrants."

    Danny Diaz, a spokesman for the Republican Party, said it had pushed ahead on recruitment of Hispanic candidates and voters. He noted that Mr. Mehlman had appeared frequently at events with Hispanic groups, hitting classic Republican themes about lower taxes and traditional values. A particular focus has been Hispanic churchgoers and pastors like Mr. Cortes, who receives money from Mr. Bush's religion-based social services initiative.

    Democrats say that Mr. Bush's success with Hispanics has not gone unnoticed. Democratic leaders in Congress have expanded their Spanish-language communications, and after 2004 the Democratic Party vowed to stop relying on payments to Hispanic groups and organizations to help turn out Hispanic voters.

    "How can you spend your money on get-out-the-vote when you are beginning to lose your market share?" Mr. Bendixen said. "But Democrats had no experience in campaigning for the hearts and minds of Hispanic voters. They treated them like black voters who they just needed to get out to the polls."

    Still, both sides say it is the tenor and ultimate outcome of the immigration debate that may give the Democrats their best opportunity to attract Hispanic voters.

    Senator Martinez, a Cuban immigrant who delivered part of a Senate speech in Spanish a few months ago, alluded to the nervousness among Hispanics when he was asked whether he would do the same again in the debate on immigration. "I am about to be sent back as it is," he said, joking. "I better be careful."

    .

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Once..just once, MAYBE a few politicians will do something that actually has the best interests of the country at its core instead of how it will effect the poll numbers. I can dream...

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Goodbye hispanic vote...
    First off, not many hispanics vote anyway, or are even registered to vote. Its like trying to pander to the 20 and under crowd.

    The Republicans have a choice. They can go along with the moderates and the liberals, vote to keep the illegals in this country and to welcome even more illegals and try to call it a "guest worker" program. If they do this they are writing their own death warrents as the Republican base will not vote for them. Or, they can do the right thing, kick out all illegals, risk the small hispanic vote, and maintain their Republican base.

    As for Whiplash's comment. Keep dreamming, my friend. The country comes last to these corrupt politicians. First comes the lobbiests, the highest bidder wins. Then come the polls, then comes who can have the biggest protests and rallies, and then finally the country's best interests.

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by RedFusion
    The Republicans have a choice. They can go along with the moderates and the liberals, vote to keep the illegals in this country and to welcome even more illegals and try to call it a "guest worker" program. If they do this they are writing their own death warrents as the Republican base will not vote for them. Or, they can do the right thing, kick out all illegals, risk the small hispanic vote, and maintain their Republican base.
    C'mon Red, what you posted is all I ask for. What irks me is that illegal aliens entered this country and then protest when they see they are about to be held accountable for their crime, YES CRIME. Are the politicians really so stupid to think illegals are going to come forward and pay fines and back taxes? Amnesty has always been the easy way out, and now we have 12,000,000 illegals in this country who are systematically bankrupting the border states as they take advantage of free healthcare and no taxes on their earnings.

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    sojustask is offline The Late, Great Lady Mod - Retired User Rank
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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    I think that the politicians will look at the numbers and vote accordingly.

    That is all they are really concerned about.

    Lady Mod

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiplash
    Are the politicians really so stupid to think illegals are going to come forward and pay fines and back taxes?
    Yes, it is laughable. Like these illegal immigrants have any money!!!! Come on people, this is a total joke. The president, along with his partners who are bent on destroying this country including McCain, Kennedy, are insulting our intelligence by telling us this. Now, if the president was really smart, instead of charging the illegals $2000 plus back taxes, he should charge them $100 billion each, that way we could wipe out our insane debt. Now doesn't that make much more sense???

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiplash
    Once..just once, MAYBE a few politicians will do something that actually has the best interests of the country at its core instead of how it will effect the poll numbers. I can dream...
    I agree. If you are an illegal immigrant you are a criminal (unlike the naive protesters on tv would have you believe). In their world we should just have open boarders and let everyone come here. Hey, why not a one world government if we are going to do that?
    No, these illegals are criminals, breaking our law and politicians need to step up to the plate and make them pay. Bush's plan is the right plan, it is not amnesty, but we also need to build a wall and make it even more difficult for these criminals to enter our country. America was built on immigrants but immigrants who followed the laws to make this country the greatest nation on this green earth.

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by Whiplash
    C'mon Red, what you posted is all I ask for. What irks me is that illegal aliens entered this country and then protest when they see they are about to be held accountable for their crime, YES CRIME. Are the politicians really so stupid to think illegals are going to come forward and pay fines and back taxes? Amnesty has always been the easy way out, and now we have 12,000,000 illegals in this country who are systematically bankrupting the border states as they take advantage of free healthcare and no taxes on their earnings.
    This is actually a smart idea. For those illegalís who are doing well (many are) this gives them a way to pay a penalty and become an American citizen. That is a good thing. For those who don't, throw them in jail and deport them as the criminals they are. The fact is there is no perfect solution. There is no way to round up all the illegal immigrants. It is just not possible. Anyone who thinks it is, is living in a fantasy world. The Bush plan is the best option for an impossible situation. All that is necessary to cap off the brilliance of this plan is to wall off the boarder to stem the flow of future illegalís.

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by Betamanmn
    This is actually a smart idea. For those illegalís who are doing well (many are) this gives them a way to pay a penalty and become an American citizen. That is a good thing. For those who don't, throw them in jail and deport them as the criminals they are. The fact is there is no perfect solution. There is no way to round up all the illegal immigrants. It is just not possible. Anyone who thinks it is, is living in a fantasy world. The Bush plan is the best option for an impossible situation. All that is necessary to cap off the brilliance of this plan is to wall off the boarder to stem the flow of future illegalís.
    Wow, a Bush lock-stepper. Those are becomming a rare find these days.

    Hey, I'll take my idea one step further....not only should illegals be deported, but so should Bush and anyone else that wants to destroy this country and turn it into Mexico.

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    in beta's world of success you judge a person by throwing them in the deep and if they swim fine if they dont,they were inherently bad or weak anyway.and if they dont struggle at all then maybe they are mentally ill or disabled and now he has to make a choice.........eany,meany my oh my!?anyone watching!?that was easy!?life's a beotch!be a beotch and live!?but hey mr. potato head if ya wanna see an eye opener i'm watching primetime special called "inside the box" could you make it out!?that's the question!?hey!as far as i'm concerned,your just as gutless as your monkey coward leader and his fellow coup members!?but yet i have to say i want the same things they are trying to achieve by the WRONG way!?hehe!!go figure!?hehe!!
    Last edited by lexx; 03-31-2006 at 04:43 AM.

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx
    in beta's world of success you judge a person by throwing them in the deep and if they swim fine if they dont,they were inherently bad or weak anyway.and if they dont struggle at all then maybe they are mentally ill or disabled and now he has to make a choice.........eany,meany my oh my!?anyone watching!?that was easy!?life's a beotch!be a beotch and live!?
    Lexx, you are not supposed to be making personal attacks against another member. Check the rules . You must post "topic" oriented.

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by sojustask
    Lexx, you are not supposed to be making personal attacks against another member. Check the rules . You must post "topic" oriented.

    Lady Mod
    OOPS!?my bad!?gotcha!hehe!!

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by RedFusion
    Wow, a Bush lock-stepper. Those are becomming a rare find these days.

    Hey, I'll take my idea one step further....not only should illegals be deported, but so should Bush and anyone else that wants to destroy this country and turn it into Mexico.
    The position of right wing loonyís! There is reality (which Bush plans address) then there is the loony fringe which wants to do the impossible and imply Gestapo tactics. Of course there is also the loony left fringe that believes these illegalís are not criminals and we should just open the boarder to everyone. It is not a matter of being lock step with Bush on everything (Iím not) it is a matter of common sense solutions for impossible problems. It is not possible to round up every illegal. It is possible to offer illegalís citizenship if they atone for their breaking of the law and pay a penalty plus go through the legalization process as all those legally coming to this country do. This is the Bush plan. Plus, even if it were possible to round up every illegal it would kill the economy and really destroy this country! The best thing that can be done is to build a wall because nothing else is going to keep illegalís from entering this country. The boarder is just too big.

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by lexx
    in beta's world of success you judge a person by throwing them in the deep and if they swim fine if they dont,they were inherently bad or weak anyway.and if they dont struggle at all then maybe they are mentally ill or disabled and now he has to make a choice.........eany,meany my oh my!?anyone watching!?that was easy!?life's a beotch!be a beotch and live!?but hey mr. potato head if ya wanna see an eye opener i'm watching primetime special called "inside the box" could you make it out!?that's the question!?hey!as far as i'm concerned,your just as gutless as your monkey coward leader and his fellow coup members!?but yet i have to say i want the same things they are trying to achieve by the WRONG way!?hehe!!go figure!?hehe!!
    My world? Not at all. In my world family, friends and the community helps an individual, not government far off which has no understanding of that individual, their needs or is able to ensure they are helped and not abuse the system. I saw "inside the box" and frankly it is programs like this that are black and white. Yes wrongs were done but to assume every criminal does not deserve that treatment or that this treatment does not produce positive results is naive. Because of some bad circumstances everything must be bad. The left has a history of watering down the strengths of this country because of a few people being hurt. For the left it is the needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many. Backwards ideology! True guts come from doing the right thing, which George Bush has done and is doing. True gutlessness is denying facts and being anti American which some on here (lexx) are guilty of.

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    Re: G.O.P. Risking Hispanic Votes on Immigration

    Quote Originally Posted by Betamanmn
    My world? Not at all. In my world family, friends and the community helps an individual, not government far off which has no understanding of that individual, their needs or is able to ensure they are helped and not abuse the system. I saw "inside the box" and frankly it is programs like this that are black and white. Yes wrongs were done but to assume every criminal does not deserve that treatment or that this treatment does not produce positive results is naive. Because of some bad circumstances everything must be bad. The left has a history of watering down the strengths of this country because of a few people being hurt. For the left it is the needs of the few outweigh the needs of the many. Backwards ideology! True guts come from doing the right thing, which George Bush has done and is doing. True gutlessness is denying facts and being anti American which some on here (lexx) are guilty of.
    LOOK!!beta answered my post!?hehe!!he loves me!?as i do him!?hehe!!
    as far as anti american.............what takes more guts!?to be pro american or anti american!?would anyone care to define the DIFFERENCE!?hehe!?just askin!?and if there is a difference...........then there must be a common ground!?for all differences are borne of misunderstanding!?for all causes seek to create a unity of purpose!?even if one side is more right than the other is not a common ground if purpose the ultimate goal!?(so ask what is the purpose)for conflict is nothing but a challenge of/to the ways of reconciliation!?for a peacefull and understanding way of life is the goal of all who know the possibilitys of man and his worst fears!?./expressed agressively!?(for all LIFE fights for existance no matter HOW it FINDS itself(defines itself!?)so those who ENJOY the best must consider those who deny the best!?AND WHY!?for judgement is mine sayeth the lord of hosts!?not to mention the 99 seeking the 1 lost sheep thingy!?and then there's the hair on your head promise!?it's all UPHILL!?believe me!?he who rides the sled down must also be willing to walk back up!?carrying THE LOAD!?and he who serves the lord of hosts must carry the load of all the sinners!?hehe!!do i serve the lord of hosts!?H E L L NO!?(i'm such a CRITIC of myself!?)but i at least see the need for such a service!?hehe!!but as a sidenote I JUST HEARD ALICE COOPER CONFESS ON THE RADIO SHOW OF HIS NAME that the ultimate meaning of LIFE is to PRAISE THE LORD!?did anyone else hear this/his testimony!?HOW GREAT IS THAT!?your servant,(reluctantly)lexx!!?just askin!?hehe!!
    Last edited by lexx; 04-04-2006 at 08:25 AM.

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