report scams here at scam.com dont get scammed Scams and Scammers - Expose hypocrisy and spread respect ! Don't get ripped off! REGISTER  

Go Back   scams > Scam Message Board > Religious Scams
Register FAQ Register To Post Member List Promote Search Today's Posts Mark Forums Read
Reply
 
Thread Tools
  #1  
Old 11-05-2005, 12:00 AM
SubJunk's Avatar
SubJunk SubJunk is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,789
Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

The following is a combination of two posts I made on my old forum, it can still be found at http://s6.invisionfree.com/New_Science/index.php and feel free to make it active again if you want to, if this happens I will renew the domain name (which used to be www.newscienceonline.com but I let it expire a couple of months ago)

I know the prominant christian view of Mary Magdeline (Maria of Magdala) is that she was a prostitute (despite the fact that in 1969 the Pope officially stated she was not a prostitute) and Jesus being the great guy he was was extra nice and merciful towards hookers. There's another theory that's stemming from much research into religious history that not only was she not a hooker, but she was of royal descent and was Jesus' wife and gave birth to his son, other theories suggest Jesus' lineage may even be alive today.
Now it has been established in studies that roughly 13% of all Jesus' quotes in the bible are true, the large majority of other quotes fabricated by the writers of the scriptures (many of which were written hundreds of years after His death)
However, certainly a point that was conveyed in the bible was that he favoured Maria over the others and they were often jealous of this.
I'd like to read more on this topic, however I've only found a couple of webpages on it.
Here's one


Bookmark and Share

Reply With Quote

  #2  
Old 11-05-2005, 12:09 AM
ComplexKid ComplexKid is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 524
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Subjunk--point here. I am still looking for evidence that Jesus existed, and aside from a line in Matthew that backtracks to Aramaic all-too-accurately as a wicked pun (likely unknown to Roman redactors, in other words, so possibly it actually was spoken), and a couple dozen lines in Josephus and Tacitus combined (and much of that being Iraneus's 'pious fraud') uhh...not finding a lot.

So long as you're not taking Christine Payne Toler's word for the Mary Magdalene stuf I suppose you're okay, but it occurs to me that Magdala was another one of those biblical names with several contradictory meanings and we don't really know which one it was meant to be.

Like--Judas Iscariot, who could be Judas the Sicarii (assassin--Aramaic version), or Judas, the Man from Keriot (if you use the Greek). Tekyu.

Biblical exegesis is a twisty game, especially when you get into the Greek Testament.




Reply With Quote

  #3  
Old 11-05-2005, 12:10 AM
Ysne58 Ysne58 is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 139
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Priory of Sion. France. Rosy Cross. House of Merovingia. Charlemagne.


Reply With Quote

  #4  
Old 11-05-2005, 12:41 AM
SubJunk's Avatar
SubJunk SubJunk is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,789
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by Ysne58
Priory of Sion. France. Rosy Cross. House of Merovingia. Charlemagne.
Yes the Da Vinci Code was an interesting and thought provoking book, one of my favourites, but a lot is pure speculation, just like the documentaries and analysis books that followed it.


Reply With Quote

  #5  
Old 11-05-2005, 12:45 AM
SubJunk's Avatar
SubJunk SubJunk is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,789
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComplexKid
Subjunk--point here. I am still looking for evidence that Jesus existed, and aside from a line in Matthew that backtracks to Aramaic all-too-accurately as a wicked pun (likely unknown to Roman redactors, in other words, so possibly it actually was spoken), and a couple dozen lines in Josephus and Tacitus combined (and much of that being Iraneus's 'pious fraud') uhh...not finding a lot.

So long as you're not taking Christine Payne Toler's word for the Mary Magdalene stuf I suppose you're okay, but it occurs to me that Magdala was another one of those biblical names with several contradictory meanings and we don't really know which one it was meant to be.

Like--Judas Iscariot, who could be Judas the Sicarii (assassin--Aramaic version), or Judas, the Man from Keriot (if you use the Greek). Tekyu.

Biblical exegesis is a twisty game, especially when you get into the Greek Testament.
I agree, it is so unfortunate they didn't have computers back then! But what we do have is many, many accounts from hundreds of people who have verified identities who saw and spoke to Jesus.
Where does the doubt about His existance come from?


Reply With Quote

  #6  
Old 11-05-2005, 12:49 AM
ComplexKid ComplexKid is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 524
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

I'm not aware of verified accounts of people who actually knew Jesus. I am, however, aware of dozens upon dozens of scribes and historians in the same area at roughly the time he's alleged to have lived--and aside from those two passages, mostly forged--nobody said a word about him.

But if there are verifiable people, list--please! I'm not so much anti-Jesus as I'm anti-what-the-Romans-did-out-of-convenience.


Reply With Quote

  #7  
Old 11-05-2005, 01:19 AM
Ysne58 Ysne58 is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Posts: 139
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

The Da Vinci Code is a good read. Its based on some books that came out before that though.

Lots of legends tied up in how the Knights Templar inherited the guardianship of what survived of House Merovingia. Lots of legends on what happened to their treasure.

National Treasure was a fun movie to watch too.


Reply With Quote

  #8  
Old 11-05-2005, 01:36 AM
Synik Synik is offline
Silver Member
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 485
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Great read!...as was "Angels and Deamons" Are his other books as compelling?


Reply With Quote

  #9  
Old 11-05-2005, 02:14 AM
SubJunk's Avatar
SubJunk SubJunk is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,789
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Sure, but he's the king of overstating the facts. Very good writer, I love his style and I have four of his books.
He has overstated many things about CERN, and skewed things about Maria Magdelina, especially her lineage which is tenuous at best.

But this discussion isn't about him.
It would explain certain things if Jesus and Maria were coupled, and since 1969 I don't see why anyone would be offended at the idea, if you're Christian you believe he was put on Earth partly to experience humanity after all.


Reply With Quote

  #10  
Old 11-05-2005, 04:37 AM
PAYEK's Avatar
PAYEK PAYEK is offline
Banned
 
Join Date: Aug 2005
Location: tornado alley
Posts: 494
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Ok, I will tell you what my sister believes. She is heavy into the Bible & she has strong views on this, which we have talked about after The Da Vinci Code came out.

She says.... Mary was a harlot who Jesus saved from being stoned to death. After that, Mary worshiped him & followed him around everywhere. (which I would too if ppl were wanting to kill me! haha)
Anyway, they became very close as friends. Jesus did not give into his "human feelings" w/her or anyone because he was stronger than that. He was pure, where we are not. He had a higher purpose on earth.
If Jesus did marry & have a child it would have been written in the Bible.


****Ok, that's what my sister thinks.
I think that not everything that happened was written in the Bible. I also think that most of what's in the Bible has been misinterpreted. I do think that if Jesus was married & had a child it would definitely be in the Bible. Or maybe it was written at one time & later taken out. I don't know..

It's an interesting idea though, to think that Jesus had a child.


Reply With Quote

  #11  
Old 11-05-2005, 04:55 AM
PaulM's Avatar
PaulM PaulM is offline
-- ---- --------, ---- ----.
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,327
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComplexKid
I'm not aware of verified accounts of people who actually knew Jesus. I am, however, aware of dozens upon dozens of scribes and historians in the same area at roughly the time he's alleged to have lived--and aside from those two passages, mostly forged--nobody said a word about him.

But if there are verifiable people, list--please! I'm not so much anti-Jesus as I'm anti-what-the-Romans-did-out-of-convenience.
I don't know of any others, but Jesus is mentioned in the writings of the historian Josephus.

cheers,
Paul


Reply With Quote

  #12  
Old 11-05-2005, 05:10 AM
ComplexKid ComplexKid is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 524
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Hi Paul -

I know he got a few lines in both Tacitus and Josephus--and that those lines were proved to mostly have been inserted into later editions of both authors by Iraneus under the excuse of 'pious fraud'.

And the part that does seem to be from Josephus himself doesn't talk about Jesus being a mashiach--just kind of a generic good guy who got crucified (as did tens of thousands of other Jews under Pilate's rule).


Reply With Quote

  #13  
Old 11-05-2005, 05:30 AM
PaulM's Avatar
PaulM PaulM is offline
-- ---- --------, ---- ----.
 
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 6,327
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComplexKid
Hi Paul -

I know he got a few lines in both Tacitus and Josephus--and that those lines were proved to mostly have been inserted into later editions of both authors by Iraneus under the excuse of 'pious fraud'.

And the part that does seem to be from Josephus himself doesn't talk about Jesus being a mashiach--just kind of a generic good guy who got crucified (as did tens of thousands of other Jews under Pilate's rule).
Exactly... all it does is mention that he lived, though I think it did mention that he did good works or was a healer... kind of goes along with the role of 'generic good guy', but no real detail.

cheers,
Paul


Reply With Quote

  #14  
Old 11-05-2005, 05:36 AM
ComplexKid ComplexKid is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 524
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

And that's it. Out of several dozens of contemporaneous historians and scribes whose still extant works would fill a few libraries. Half a dozen lines in a couple texts we know were tampered with, and if Jesus was called Yehoshua (seems the most likely Hebrew transliteration), it was a pretty common name.

And the line in Matthew that does seem like it could indeed have been spoken by a Saducee priest and a later redactor would not likely to have been cluey enough to have made it up.

And a lot of folks got killed. Probably more than one 'Rabbi Yehoshua' among them.

Which isn't a completely 'anti' argument, just there isn't a whole lot of anything to say for sure.

Edited to add: But the 'Barabbas' thing is still bugging me. It's just way too obvious for anyone with even a rudimentary knowledge of Aramaic. Then again, that could be midrash (morality tale) more than actual fact.

It's okay. G-d-wrestling is my favourite sport.



Last edited by ComplexKid : 11-05-2005 at 05:41 AM.
Reply With Quote

  #15  
Old 11-05-2005, 06:01 AM
ComplexKid ComplexKid is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 524
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Ehh...have a fair number of sabra friends, and lots of Hebrew type relations. Nobody's named Jesus.

A couple of Nimrod's in there, though (I kid you not, wish I did!)


Reply With Quote

  #16  
Old 11-05-2005, 06:08 AM
SubJunk's Avatar
SubJunk SubJunk is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,789
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by ComplexKid
Hi Paul -

I know he got a few lines in both Tacitus and Josephus--and that those lines were proved to mostly have been inserted into later editions of both authors by Iraneus under the excuse of 'pious fraud'.

And the part that does seem to be from Josephus himself doesn't talk about Jesus being a mashiach--just kind of a generic good guy who got crucified (as did tens of thousands of other Jews under Pilate's rule).
I thought Josephus mentioned Jesus working miracles.

Pliny the Younger also mentioned Jesus in letters to Emperor Trajan.
The Babylonian Talmud also mentions Jesus being "hanged".
Then there's Lucian of Samosata mentioning the "leader of the Christians who was crucified" or something to that effect.
I'm sure there are more...


Reply With Quote

  #17  
Old 11-05-2005, 06:13 AM
SubJunk's Avatar
SubJunk SubJunk is offline
Moderator
 
Join Date: Sep 2004
Location: New Zealand
Posts: 1,789
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Well here is a bad example, but there was a Pagan writer called Thallus who apparently referred to Jesus and said that when he was crucified there was an earthquake and unusual darkness.
The problem with this is that no one can seem to find what Thallus wrote, there are only third-party references to that writing.


Reply With Quote

  #18  
Old 11-05-2005, 06:24 AM
ComplexKid ComplexKid is offline
Gold Member
 
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 524
Re: Jesus and Maria Magdelina's Relationship

Quote:
Originally Posted by SubJunk
I thought Josephus mentioned Jesus working miracles.

Pliny the Younger also mentioned Jesus in letters to Emperor Trajan.
The Babylonian Talmud also mentions Jesus being "hanged".
Then there's Lucian of Samosata mentioning the "leader of the Christians who was crucified" or something to that effect.
I'm sure there are more...
Pliny the Younger--you may be right.
Babylonian Talmud--I think you're mixing up Jesus with Yeshu ha Notzri
Lucian--questionable--Christianity didn't exist during Jesus' lifetime (if he lived), and crucifixion was a popular Roman sport. Christians started getting crucified in Rome sometime after that though.
Josephus--the miracles part was Iraneus's invention.

Which still comes back to no first-hand accounts by anyone we know was real. I would need to look it up, but I know there are accounts of weather reports and weird weather/astronomical phenomena of the time, and there wasn't an earthquake or eclipse in those when there should've been. May take a couple days to find a reference on that, though, and if I can't, we'll hand you that one.



Reply With Quote

Reply

Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
My Favorite Resorts and Maria Rosso SedonaCoyotes Hotel Scams 14 10-11-2012 10:56 PM
Maria Duval sweetie-pie Mail Order Scams 81 12-10-2011 12:34 PM
Chase bank. Maria V. Marcotte marmar Business Scams 7 01-25-2010 11:01 AM
UFO Relationship to ' God ' ? Kevin Puppos Religious Scams 3 12-25-2009 02:23 PM
Maria Duval bobbylj Business Scams 1 10-20-2006 06:51 PM

Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is On
Forum Jump




This site may contain advice, opinions and statements of various information providers. Scam.com does not represent or endorse the accuracy or reliability of any advice, opinion, statement or other information provided by any information provider, any User of this Site or any other person or entity. Reliance upon any such advice, opinion, statement, or other information shall also be at the Userís own risk. Neither Scam.com nor its affiliates, nor any of their respective agents, employees, information providers or content providers, shall be liable to any User or anyone else for any inaccuracy, error, omission, interruption, deletion, defect, alteration of or use of any content herein, or for its timeliness or completeness, nor shall they be liable for any failure of performance, computer virus or communication line failure, regardless of cause, or for any damages resulting therefrom. Just because a business, person, or entity is listed on scam.com does not necessarily constitute they are scammers. This is a free open forum where people can debate the merits from the consumer's or business owner's perspective. Registration and participation is always FREE.


All times are GMT -5. The time now is 12:32 AM.




Scam.com Is Proudly Hosted By Rackco and Protected By CloudFlare


Scams Message Board - Copyright 2004-2013 Scam.com , All Rights Reserved.