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  #1  
Old 02-08-2008, 01:01 AM
Paladine's Avatar
Paladine Paladine is offline
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Iran approaching the "high frontier"

Quote:
Iran launches rocket, unveils space centre
Last Updated: Monday, February 4, 2008 | 6:43 PM ET
The Associated Press

Iran launched a research rocket and unveiled its first major space centre, state television reported Monday, the latest steps in a program many fear may be a cover for further development of its military ballistic missiles.

State television showed live images of the event, with President Mahmoud Ahmadinejad issuing the launch order.

Iranian officials have said they are developing a Shahab-4 missile to launch a satellite. Iran's powerful ballistic missile, the Shahab-3, is believed to have a range of at least 1,300 kilometres, putting Israel and much of the Middle East in range. In November, Iran said it had manufactured a new missile, the Ashoura, with a range of 2,000 kilometres.

Iran, which also unveiled its first domestically-built satellite on Monday, says it wants to put its own satellites into orbit to monitor natural disasters in the earthquake-prone country and improve its telecommunications.

Iranian officials also point to the United States' use of satellites to monitor Afghanistan and Iraq and say they need similar abilities for their security.

Iran has long declared a goal of developing a space program, but the same technology used to put satellites in space can also be used to deliver warheads. The country's space program, like its nuclear power program, has provoked unease abroad.

'Troubling development'

"It is just another troubling development," U.S. State Department spokesman Sean McCormack said. "And, of course, the UN Security Council and other members of the international system have expressed their deep concern about Iran's continuing development of medium- and long-range ballistic missiles."

Despite concern over Iran's space program, it is not clear how far along it is, or whether the latest launch actually reached the internationally agreed upon beginning of "space," set at 100 kilometres above the earth.

Analysts have expressed doubts about certain technological achievements announced by Iran in the past. The country launched its first domestically-built rocket last February, which soared to the edge of space but did not reach orbit level.

On Monday, state-run television did not specify the altitude when announcing the launch. "With the launch, Iran has joined the world's top 11 countries possessing space technology to build satellites and launch rockets into space," it announced.

The lowest flying satellites — ham radio satellites — orbit between 160 and 500 kilometres up, while communication, weather and global-positioning satellites fly between 400 and 20,000 kilometres up.
President opens control station, launch pad

Before the launch, Ahmadinejad opened Iran's first major space centre, which includes a space launch pad and underground control station.

"We need to have an active and influential presence in space," he said.

The official news agency IRNA reported that the new domestically built satellite — called Omid, or Hope — would be launched into orbit sometime in the next 12 months.

In 2005, the government said it had allocated $500 million US for space projects in the next five years. That year, Iran launched its first commercial satellite into orbit from a Russian rocket in a joint project with Moscow, which appears to be the main partner in transferring space technology to Iran.

Iran hopes to launch four more satellites by 2010, the government has said.
So, Iran broaches the "high frontier".

Not bad for "fanatics still stuck in the middle ages", as some characterize certain middle eastern nations and peoples.

Of course some (but not this artical) will claim it is merely subterfuge and an extension of Iran's "program" to wipe out Israel, the American way of life and to "kill us all" since access to space requires similar technology.

If I were Iran I would invest alot of money into ICBMs as well (as a deterent to an increasingly biligerant and aggressive US). Now if people could just learn to share and get along.

I Dont see why anyone would have a problem with Iran having this technology. If anyone fears the motive, Iran has had to live with that fear for awhile now. Iran should, without any interferences

No-one really has a problem with iran having this sort of a technology but Israel... and since they control the North American media (especially US) and it's government, we are all made to believe that its the days of doom and gloom! please know that Iran (old name Persia) has not invaded another country in 300 years!

It would be vastly cheaper to have any one of a dozen nations to launch communication satellites.

It might be less costly but Iran doesn't really have to worry about that to the same extent as many other nations (oil $ and all, don't you know).

The greater cost more than justifies itself in the long run because it allows them control over their own interests (which they wouldn't have if they had to rely on the good will of a third party).

I find it interesting that Russia ( one of Iran's allies ) consider it to be a cover for long range rockets as well.
I suppose that you consider Russia to be anti-Iran fanatics as well.

As quoted of the BBC
Quote:
Russia thinks the launch of an Iranian rocket into space raises suspicion over the true aim of its nuclear programme, a foreign ministry official has said.
"Long-range missiles are one of the components of a [nuclear] weapons system," Deputy Foreign Minister Alexander Losyukov told Interfax.
Therefore Monday's test launch of Iran's Explorer-1 space rocket was "of course, a cause for concern", he said.
Or, they don't like the idea of losing a customer and gaining a competitor in the space biz.

Russia is afraid of waking up one day and finding ballistic missiles pointing at it, not only from Iran, but from Iranian client states along the Russian border. There would be some justice in seeing the Russians' dirty arms deals and technology transfers to rogue states come back to bite them.

the Iran's space program, it's yet another attempt by this high maintenance country to get some international attention, just like their nuclear program. When it comes to wacky provocation, Iran never disappoints. It's too bad they don't spend some of their petro dollars on building infrastructure, promoting education and developing peaceful technology.

Anyone can build a long-range rocket. The technology has been around for almost 50 years. It it even easier to make than a nuclear weapon



Why should they be dependent on a third party for their needs just to satisfy a few anti-Iran fanatics in the US?


this recent satellite launch should also be seen as nothing, but another way of attention seeking. Iranians want good relations with the US. It is about time that some sort of high level diplomatic relation be established between Iran and USA. Iran needs America and America needs Iran.

So, Iran broaches the "high frontier".
I think it's cool when any country takes an interest in space.

Why is the USA so afraid of Iran developing its own space technology... why are they so afraid of them? Seriously, what have they ever done to them? and please don't repeat the same brainwashing material that the the media feeds you, but seriously what has iran ever done? You wanna talk about iranian terrorism? well, that is the BIGGEST stereotype there is...

Iranians have never hijacked anything blown anything up or fired a single shot ever, but to defend themselves when they were invaded (iran-iraq war) by saddam who was encouraged by the wast by the way, using US support and US weapons, to do so.

You wanna talk about their support for Hizbullah? well someone has to stop Israel from bombing Lebanese schools and hospitals don't you agree?...I mean what about Israeli's acts of terror? the Iranians look at hizbullah as a desprate people defending their country... something any proud people would do...

if anything though Iranians fear the west more than we do them, hence the reason why they are developing their own defense capabilities. Now why would iran be afraid of the west you ask? well because SOMEBODY parked a couple of aircraft carriers, fully loaded, just off its coast along with a whole bunch of warships... What would we do if the situation was reversed i often wonder...

Quote:
"This new test, presented by the Iranian authorities as the illustration of a space program when the missile in question does not have extra-atmospheric capabilities, is a further source of concern," she added.
Interesting how this "assessment" conveniently ignores the fact that every (current) spacefaring nation began their development with high-altitude and sub-orbital test launches before attempting actual orbital space flight. Even Shepard's flight, the first American in "space", didn't have the "oomph" to reach orbit.

That this first launch didn't have the technological capability of reaching orbital altitudes or function at those altitudes means bupkus (the first efforts of the US, USSR, France, China, India, etc couldn't do it either) in determining intention as it is simply the way that developing a launch vehicle works.

It is simply a fact that space flight involves dual-use technology and there is no way to get around that.

Quote:
At nearly 60 ft. long, the upgraded Shahab-3 carries about 15% more propellant and has a more bulbous nose (see photo). This indicates a different reentry vehicle design similar to that used on the Russian SS-9 ICBM.

The new design appears to be a warhead capable of carrying an avionics unit on separation from the booster--a design that could enable air-burst nuclear weapons fusing during reentry...

As reported by avionics weekly

Nice red herring there.

In fact, a great many launch vehicles are largely identical to ICBM's. For instance, the Vostok and Soyuz launch vehicles are actually SS-6's, the Kosmos is an SS-5, the Rokot is an SS-19 and Start is an SS-25.

The Mercury capsule was launched by a Redstone ICBM (later an Atlas ICBM), Gemini was carried on a Titan ICBM. US launch vehicles did not become solely purpose-built until Saturn was required for the moon landings but, even today, most US satellites are launched atop modified ICBM's.

Current Iranian satellite designs are in the 20 - 80 kg range, smaller than a multiple megaton nuke. Any initial launch vehicle designs would be engineered for this weight range (as in, similar in appearance and lift capacity to an ICBM).

It is an inescapable fact that satellite launch vehicles and ICBM's are virtually identical in terms of the required technology and design parameters.




Surly one might argue they are there to maintain the peace, well for the iranians thats sort of hard to believe because those same US warships have sunk a couple of Iranian frigates in the past (IS Sahand, IS Sabalan), destroyed an Iranian Oil rig (Oil platform Sassan) and
shot down an iranian airline killing all 290 civilians on board (Iran Air Flight 655-Airbus).

Now what would have we done if we were in their shoes, seriously be honest and look at it with an open mind from the other side of the table...



Persia was inventing technology, and scoping out the stars, before America was a country.
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The internet is the last light of truth and hope...it is truly of the people, by the people and for the people. We must not let it be subverted for any purpose other than the truth. And that truth shall spread to every man woman and child across the globe. No longer will those in power carry the sole means to decide for us, yet we now shall have the power to decide to tune them out.



Last edited by Paladine : 02-08-2008 at 01:20 AM.
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  #2  
Old 02-08-2008, 09:24 AM
steve burns steve burns is offline
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Re: Iran approaching the "high frontier"

Dont know about you, but if I meet a stranger in a dark alley, I prefer he be unarmed, whether he means me harm or not.
I am on the side of the United States being the strongest power around. I dont give a crap if its "fair" or not. I don't want ANY other country to have military equality. I would rather be safe than fair. This is life, not a sympathy or board game.
If you are on the Iranian side...you have a different view. Obvously, you are.



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  #3  
Old 02-08-2008, 10:32 AM
California Surfin
 
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Re: Iran approaching the "high frontier"

Dont worry ...

Bush is on top of all issues in the Middle East

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  #4  
Old 02-08-2008, 10:52 PM
Paladine's Avatar
Paladine Paladine is offline
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Re: Iran approaching the "high frontier"

Quote:
Originally Posted by steve burns View Post
Dont know about you, but if I meet a stranger in a dark alley, I prefer he be unarmed, whether he means me harm or not.
I am on the side of the United States being the strongest power around. I dont give a crap if its "fair" or not. I don't want ANY other country to have military equality. I would rather be safe than fair. This is life, not a sympathy or board game.
If you are on the Iranian side...you have a different view. Obvously, you are.
Hitler would of loved you.

Too bad he failed just like you will

Iran does not attack anyone.

America is the one attacking the world.



your view? to whom you are being compared, would include anyone whose agenda is primarily genocidal (and "genocide" is the correct term for murdering people because of their religion, land stealing, or ethnic identity.) The "worst of them" would include Al Qaeda, the Janjaweed militias in Darfur, the "ethnic cleansers" on all sides in the Balkan wars, the Nazis and their concentration camps, the Japanese invaders of China During World War II -- even the US government during the 20th century and 19th century with it's modern mar machine and systematic exterminations of native peoples.

Please explain why your attitude is any different from Hitlers?

remember that the US promulgated anti-Western sentiment in Iran by supporting the military dictatorship of the Shah as well as arming Iraq. you meddled in the affairs of all of the Middle Eastern states, strictly for your own benefit, to some extent for decades -- is it any wonder many of their citizens (and the world in general) resent you and are so easily swayed by your medias propaganda, and religion power bases ?


my analysis is not based on emotion, hate, fear, or otherwise.
It is a dispassionate evaluation of the threat to secular, world society from those individuals who base their world view and mind set on the vile, barbaric, roman, nazi fantasies of rapist, pedophile and murderer. Whether they number in the thousands or hundreds of millons is irrelevant. The threat The usa poses is unacceptable .. the earth cannot cede the future and the soul of man to the backward, evil garbage of the nazi again!.


Unfourtunally, the same is true now ~ as it was with the Spanish/ American War and the Viet Nam War ~ Events were constructed and put into place by people that found wealth to be gain with military conflict ~ and again , the American people shallowed it , hook , line and sinker. ~ It was a well though out plan with no regard to little ~ except profits.

We have been played!


War is an Industry, not unlike any other! The posssibility of Gains and Losses are great ~

You can look at it from many different ways ~ Young men die , while old men get rich

Or ~ As providing a proving ground for high tech research and development of weapons against personal, stationary and moving targets. ~ A way of ensuring your nation ~ that you are the meanest and baddest sons of bit~hes on the planet. you do that well.

You are demonic.

In anycase ~ you've being lied too! ~

Harry Truman had one of the most difficult decisions any ONE man might ever make in the history of the world to THIS day. ~ Is it right to drop it? ~ His performance was nothing less then excellence for a president of America. ~ A heavy burden to bear for one man. you were in a protracted global war , you were fighting several fronts in several hemispheres with countless wounded and dead on both sides.
It was time to take the gloves off and put an end to it.

What you got now ~ ? ~ anything to compare to Harrys problem??

you were angry about 9/11 ~ so you made an example out of a few wimps that fit the general discription. Kicked their house in. Murderder millions of innocents ~ Your great president Ronnie Rayguns, did about the same thing ~ really worst ~ You sustain over 300 marines dead in the Buruit Bombing~ what you do ??? pull out and inside 30 days~ attack Kadaffe with a F111 attact and invade Granada ~~ Wooo! you are some bad mofros!

~ ~ I don't know if a democrate would have offered us better leadership in these times? ~ I just don't know ?~ But I do know that a Rupublican was sitting in the big chair when this all came to be. ~ this , this , lets' give the American people something to cheer about!! ~ CraP! ~ Feed the Roman people, satisfy the blood lust ~ just get them off my ass. ~ don't know about you , but it makes me ill? My thinking is one bullet one known target down. ~ not what we see today.

This present debacle ~ could have been avoided ~ but the military complex, not the soliders ~~~ ruled the day. ~ The commander and chief and company ~ is but a shadow puppet, a front man for war profiteers and the military support complex. Thats been very clear for a good 6 years.

Your senior military men were shouted down by Donald Rumfield and his support group, you know their names now ~ don't you?

Donald and Geo Bush ~ cerdentials quilify them as team supporters~ Cheer Leaders! they ARE cheerleaders!!!!!! `~ so where is the good ole team spirit?
they don' t know sh~t from shoe polish about military engagement, much less a occupational force and whats worst they want listen to anyone that does!


some buddies of a cretin pres are all getting richer and richer.that's is the point..it will never end because corporations need to make more money each quarter.
why do you think Iran is next.
endless war means endless profits.........

The only country that is hurting/destroy america is... America!
haha not the boogyman under your bed


watch the Iraq war documentary "No End in Sight"

http://video.google.com/videoplay?do...arch&plindex=1

http://www.torrentreactor.net/torren...SC.DVDR.JFKDVD


The main point that the film underscores is that the Bush dministration completely bungled the operation from Day One -- actually "bungled" is too mild a word -- their unbelievable ineptness, ignorance and arrogance were unconscionable. They completely ignored and shut out their own most well-informed military and political experts and advisory panels -- it turns out that the president (sorry, can't bring myself to capitalize the title) did not even read ANY of the detailed reports and recommendations that were prepared -- NOT EVEN SINGLE PAGE SUMMARIES -- before dismissing them.

In my opinion, all of the people at high levels who were ultimately responsible for the policies (or, more precisely, lack of them) that were utilized in Iraq should be removed from office and prosecuted for dereliction of duty, at the very least, if not criminally negligent manslaughter, even high treason. The current absolute chaos in Iraq is directly the fault of their incompetent failure to follow through with a cohesive security and reconstruction plan after the invasion, not some "inevitable religious war."

Anyone who voted for Bush/Cheney should see this film: I believe they will feel ashamed, outraged and betrayed. I've no doubt this administration will go down in history as the one that caused the most lasting damage to the Republic, both at home and in the world.


You know, it could be persuasively argued that Christianity is "backward, evil garbage" that poses a "threat to secular, democratic western society". who would care to volunteer for systematic purging for the good of the State? And please explain where broad-spectrum genocide fits into your personal version I'm pretty well-acquainted with the teachings of Jesus of Nazareth (who is, by the way, honored by Muslims as a great prophet) and I don't recall anything about mass execution of followers of other faiths.

I'd invite you to see the film to expand your evidently somewhat limited understanding of the circumstances surrounding the "war".

The film only reinforced to me what I already knew or, at least, suspected (though even I was shocked by the blatant arrogance and incompetence that was revealed.) I was an anti-war activist during the Viet Nam years, protested against the Senior Bush's first Gulf War and have actively campaigned against Bush Jr. and all of his inept and egregious policies since Day One.

the US populace let itself be hoodwinked but I see hopeful signs that enough of them have come to their senses and are going to call the perpetrators to account -- I think films like this can only help the process along.
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The internet is the last light of truth and hope...it is truly of the people, by the people and for the people. We must not let it be subverted for any purpose other than the truth. And that truth shall spread to every man woman and child across the globe. No longer will those in power carry the sole means to decide for us, yet we now shall have the power to decide to tune them out.


Last edited by Paladine : 02-08-2008 at 11:42 PM.
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  #5  
Old 02-09-2008, 12:06 AM
steve burns steve burns is offline
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Re: Iran approaching the "high frontier"

[quote=Paladine;484342]Hitler would of loved you.

Too bad he failed just like you will

It was because of people like you that Hitler almost didn't fail.
It was because of people like you that World War II started.

Individuals who were too blind to see the truth, and cowards that were too afraid to act.

You are the danger to civilization. Its you that Hitler would have loved, and your Muslim friends love you now.

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Old 02-09-2008, 07:39 PM
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Paladine Paladine is offline
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Re: Iran approaching the "high frontier"

[quote=steve burns;484374]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladine View Post
Hitler would of loved you.

Too bad he failed just like you will

It was because of people like you that Hitler almost didn't fail.
It was because of people like you that World War II started.

Individuals who were too blind to see the truth, and cowards that were too afraid to act.

You are the danger to civilization. Its you that Hitler would have loved, and your Muslim friends love you now.


History says otherwise. The world was a lot safer place before the US interfered in the middle east. Stalin, Roosevelt and Churchill met in Tehran for a conference. Do you see that happening today?. The US has a 50 year history of destabilizing the middle east and Bush has done more to destabilise it than any ther president.

But try getting on skype and searching for our guys over there...ask them what THEY think of the situation as they now know it.



Quote:
You are the danger to civilization.
i don't think the mothers of dead us soldiers and innocent Iranian civilians will think so,and while people are loosing there homes due to the falling economy another war is just what you need isn't it.

and for each iranian killed there's 3 or 4 with a vendetta, a hatred of America and nothing left to lose. This is a terrorists wet dream. From 1953 to the present moment to country on earth has done more to promote Islamic terrorism than the United states.

Follow.

The.

Money.

Live and let live. Only time they threaten you is if you get too close to them.This is the right of every country.

you are territorial by nature and you treat the same with foreign fishing vessels near your boundarys.


Forcing an entire proud culture to your own liking will not be welcome. Iraq is the primary example. If Western rule was all that good in Asia and Africa, then they wouldn't have kicked out their western masters at the first place.

If British rule was all that good, India and Pakistan wouldn't have fought for their independence since 1857. You can't dictate your nazi values on some other culture and think that what might going to work for you may going to work for them.

Dont forget, India, and Middle East were the masters of the world ones. For 1000 years they were ruling the world when American was not even discovered.

And you expect these countries to take dictation from the west? Again, why should they listen to the west?

When they tried to adopt their so called "democractic" system, their govts were overthrown because instead of the western interest they wanted to work for their own people? And those democratic countries were replaced by dictators like Shah of Iran, Mobutu in Congo, Idi Amin in uganda?


I have no real problem with any country having weapons. But when they use them outside their own borders I get a bit nervous.

And in the past 50 years Iran has a whole hell of a lot less to answer for than the US.

Iran doesn't invade and war with any one. Obtaining technology of any sort is the right of every nation. No country has the right to monopolise certain type of technology.
Who is responsible for turning Iran in to America's number 1 enemy?

No one but your own lovely government. Any good history book on Iran from 1950s on wards will provide disturbing details of American manipulation of Iran.

I suggest people to and pick up a good book on how America and the west have been the true murders of democracies in countries like Iran and in Latin America after seeing the results not to their likings.

Hyprocrisy.
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The internet is the last light of truth and hope...it is truly of the people, by the people and for the people. We must not let it be subverted for any purpose other than the truth. And that truth shall spread to every man woman and child across the globe. No longer will those in power carry the sole means to decide for us, yet we now shall have the power to decide to tune them out.


Last edited by Paladine : 02-09-2008 at 08:24 PM.
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Old 02-13-2008, 07:49 AM
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Paladine Paladine is offline
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Re: Iran approaching the "high frontier"

Quote:
Okay situation I'm stuck in Iraq so all I can do is build comfort, get the girls to invest themselves by coaching them to do things like send packages and arrange phone times etc..

Here's the deal, I didn't know how powerful the myspace and top ten friends can be. I did a pre-test and arranged my line up and #1 was playful in her response to being #4. What would a good follow up be? Should I neg her by saying I had to put her in the friends row. Top 4 is for the "ladies" or should I neg her for being jealous, do a combination of what? I have like 6 months before I go on leave so I got to slow play this out tell than. So yeah it's a bitch cause I got to almost do all phases at once and prolong attraction to than.

A side note, #1 and I have been friends with benefits for a couple years now, but we stop a year ago just found other options. But I'm trying to make sure I got a good line up for vacation time.... so any suggestions?

You know the PUA should develope a military section.
sendpm.gif
Dont look like the US soldiers have got much to do over in iraq besides drugs and gaming chicks online..
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The internet is the last light of truth and hope...it is truly of the people, by the people and for the people. We must not let it be subverted for any purpose other than the truth. And that truth shall spread to every man woman and child across the globe. No longer will those in power carry the sole means to decide for us, yet we now shall have the power to decide to tune them out.

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Old 02-16-2008, 10:26 PM
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Paladine Paladine is offline
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Re: Iran approaching the "high frontier"

[quote=steve burns;484374]
Quote:
Originally Posted by Paladine View Post
Hitler would of loved you.

Too bad he failed just like you will

It was because of people like you that Hitler almost didn't fail.
It was because of people like you that World War II started.

Individuals who were too blind to see the truth, and cowards that were too afraid to act.

You are the danger to civilization. Its you that Hitler would have loved, and your Muslim friends love you now.


your argument is based on throwing two different men together, saddam was never a threat to the world, hitler was, iraq’s army was small, germany’s was large, iraq’s weapons were not impressive, germany’s were-

america fought germany as a defensive move, the US entered iraq with no provocation other that an ill-informed belief that saddam had WMDs (it is doubtful that bush’s minions believed this at all)

the US did not supply hitler with weapons (although preston bush, wall strret the queen and the vatican all funded hitler), The US did supply saddam with weapons, bush did not view saddam even as a threat until he magically appeared on his radar in 2001, also, europe was united against hitler, europe did not join forces with the US when they invaded iraq because they did not see saddam as a serious threat, iraq was kept together by saddam and civil war was kept in check, (that is why "Iraqis refused to take advantage of Hussein's death" because they're not in a position to) -even cheney states as much in his 1991 speech when he said…

“Once you’ve got Baghdad, it’s not clear what you do with it. It’s not clear what kind of government you would put in place of the one that’s currently there.... How much credibility is that government going to have if it’s set up by the United States military when it’s there?.... I think to have American military forces engaged in a civil war inside Iraq would fit the definition of quagmire, and we have absolutely no desire to get bogged down in that fashion.”

how prophetic were his words!

you write as if america should be in the role of defending the world’s citizens against their own rulers, if this is so, why did we invade iraq and yet we watch the genocide taking place in the sudan and do nothing? i can tell you why in one word- OIL!!!


I have seen many peoples of different cultures from my travels,
I have been in over 30 countries , During those times I lived among the citizens and dealt with them on a daily basis. You can learn a lot about people by living among them.
and one thing you noticed around the world when you look at the people with an open mind is that people all around the world are all the same... what drives us apart from eachother at times is lack of knowledge and a lack of an open mind about the other cultures...

I can almost guarantee you, that those who are trigger happy and want to go to war with another nation on a spin of a dime, are those who have never met (or wanted to meet) anyone from the opposing country... To talk to them with an open mind and/or dialog to see that, hey these guys aren't much different from us after all... and if they are behaving somehow in a way that we dont agree with, to figure out what the cause is ... and would we have done the same if we were in their shoes? and what can we do to resolve it...
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The internet is the last light of truth and hope...it is truly of the people, by the people and for the people. We must not let it be subverted for any purpose other than the truth. And that truth shall spread to every man woman and child across the globe. No longer will those in power carry the sole means to decide for us, yet we now shall have the power to decide to tune them out.



Last edited by Paladine : 02-16-2008 at 10:31 PM.
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